ALPA Contract Comparison
08-23-2018, 06:17 AM
#31
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2016
Posts: 287
That’s why I said few. I was just trying to advise a Delta pilot you need not look to our contact for things you would like to get in your next contract. I saved you the time looking at the comparison. I am well aware how poor our contract compares. Over my 20 year career I am still doing better than if I were hired at Delta or United at the same time. Our time will come soon. I hope.
08-23-2018, 06:49 AM
#32
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2018
Posts: 3,237
Can I get the same type of kick back for not using paid parking? (commuter at non Delta station)
I asked about this a month or so ago and was told to pound sand, now when it affects specific individuals their perspectives change....(not you specifically but that was the general gist)
I asked about this a month or so ago and was told to pound sand, now when it affects specific individuals their perspectives change....(not you specifically but that was the general gist)
08-23-2018, 08:05 AM
#33
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 3,149
The problem is, what about bases where the company incurs no parking costs?
08-23-2018, 08:13 AM
#34
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: Kickin’ Back
Posts: 6,971
Riiiiiight.... That is not a choice for the majority of Delta pilots and you know it.
You miss my point. That point being the Union cannot strictly negotiate items that affect 100% of the pilots. There will be items negotiated that affect different groups differently.
Denny
You miss my point. That point being the Union cannot strictly negotiate items that affect 100% of the pilots. There will be items negotiated that affect different groups differently.
Denny
08-23-2018, 08:16 AM
#35
Moderator
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,807
I have to agree with you. Be nice if Delta said, "Hey, we were going to spend this much on your parking pass" so we will reimburse you up to that cost if you purchase an employee parking pass at your commuting airport."
The problem is, what about bases where the company incurs no parking costs?
The problem is, what about bases where the company incurs no parking costs?
08-23-2018, 08:27 AM
#36
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Position: Fastest Hunk of Junk in the Galaxy
Posts: 1,657
Can I get the same type of kick back for not using paid parking? (commuter at non Delta station)
I asked about this a month or so ago and was told to pound sand, now when it affects specific individuals their perspectives change....(not you specifically but that was the general gist)
I asked about this a month or so ago and was told to pound sand, now when it affects specific individuals their perspectives change....(not you specifically but that was the general gist)
Let's be pragmatic and just deal with reality instead of your silly straw man. At some point we will get a contract to vote on which will require a majority of votes to pass. Most pilots will vote for what is in their best interest, a few might even vote for what they believe to be the greater good. Two big topics currently getting a lot of attention are retirement and medical (sorry, but I don't think your parking woes will crack the top 100). Fact is Delta has hired roughly 4000 pilots since 2014, if our negotiators try and sell a contract that has retirement benefits that don't include those 4000 it will have trouble passing memrat.
Likewise, a significant % of Delta pilots use their spouse's insurance or Tricare. If the crowning achievement of C19 is improved health care without adding any benefit to those who don't use Delta insurance, then our negotiators have accomplished nothing for a very large segment of the pilots they represent. For every pilot who elects to participate in Delta's insurance plan there is a cost to the company. A way to get your health care home run is to make sure that all pilots support the initiative, and the easiest way to do that is make the health care optional with an offset benefit to those who don't participate.
The surefire way to make sure nothing passes is to divide the pilot group into haves and have-nots or try to vilify pilots who don't support initiatives that do nothing to make their own lives better. Look at TA2, there were no special interests who won out over the pilot group at-large and the contract passed with overwhelming support. The current MEC and many posters here seem intent on getting their piece of the pie at the expense of the rest of the pilot group. If that's the way our negotiators go management will win because it will set pilot against pilot and we won't have a contract for years.
Riiiiiight.... That is not a choice for the majority of Delta pilots and you know it.
You miss my point. That point being the Union cannot strictly negotiate items that affect 100% of the pilots. There will be items negotiated that affect different groups differently.
Denny
You miss my point. That point being the Union cannot strictly negotiate items that affect 100% of the pilots. There will be items negotiated that affect different groups differently.
Denny
08-23-2018, 09:31 AM
#37
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: Kickin’ Back
Posts: 6,971
If you can't differentiate between these subjects I can't help you, you can reference the hundreds of posts on choosing to commute vs choosing to move to base and get your answers there. If you're just being obtuse then I'm on board with everybody who told you to go pound sand.
Let's be pragmatic and just deal with reality instead of your silly straw man. At some point we will get a contract to vote on which will require a majority of votes to pass. Most pilots will vote for what is in their best interest, a few might even vote for what they believe to be the greater good. Two big topics currently getting a lot of attention are retirement and medical (sorry, but I don't think your parking woes will crack the top 100). Fact is Delta has hired roughly 4000 pilots since 2014, if our negotiators try and sell a contract that has retirement benefits that don't include those 4000 it will have trouble passing memrat.
Likewise, a significant % of Delta pilots use their spouse's insurance or Tricare. If the crowning achievement of C19 is improved health care without adding any benefit to those who don't use Delta insurance, then our negotiators have accomplished nothing for a very large segment of the pilots they represent. For every pilot who elects to participate in Delta's insurance plan there is a cost to the company. A way to get your health care home run is to make sure that all pilots support the initiative, and the easiest way to do that is make the health care optional with an offset benefit to those who don't participate.
A few comments on this paragraph. What is a “significant percentage?” A majority or a “significant” minority? You are advocating improving a section of the contract that will only benefit a portion of the group. I’ve been told that’s not cool.
The surefire way to make sure nothing passes is to divide the pilot group into haves and have-nots or try to vilify pilots who don't support initiatives that do nothing to make their own lives better. Look at TA2, there were no special interests who won out over the pilot group at-large and the contract passed with overwhelming support. The current MEC and many posters here seem intent on getting their piece of the pie at the expense of the rest of the pilot group. If that's the way our negotiators go management will win because it will set pilot against pilot and we won't have a contract for years.
Can you not see the conflict in your last two paragraphs? In the first one you are advocating just what you are vilifying in the next!!! You are advocating that a special interest group (one that has other options for their healthcare) get a benefit that the majority cannot. Just because this special interest group might opt out of medical coverage doesn’t mean it’s not a negotiated benefit for them. One that they have access to if needed.
I don't think I am missing your point at all. I'm dealing with the reality of getting a contract that can pass memrat. If C19 turns into a special interest land grab it will never pass.
Let's be pragmatic and just deal with reality instead of your silly straw man. At some point we will get a contract to vote on which will require a majority of votes to pass. Most pilots will vote for what is in their best interest, a few might even vote for what they believe to be the greater good. Two big topics currently getting a lot of attention are retirement and medical (sorry, but I don't think your parking woes will crack the top 100). Fact is Delta has hired roughly 4000 pilots since 2014, if our negotiators try and sell a contract that has retirement benefits that don't include those 4000 it will have trouble passing memrat.
Likewise, a significant % of Delta pilots use their spouse's insurance or Tricare. If the crowning achievement of C19 is improved health care without adding any benefit to those who don't use Delta insurance, then our negotiators have accomplished nothing for a very large segment of the pilots they represent. For every pilot who elects to participate in Delta's insurance plan there is a cost to the company. A way to get your health care home run is to make sure that all pilots support the initiative, and the easiest way to do that is make the health care optional with an offset benefit to those who don't participate.
A few comments on this paragraph. What is a “significant percentage?” A majority or a “significant” minority? You are advocating improving a section of the contract that will only benefit a portion of the group. I’ve been told that’s not cool.
The surefire way to make sure nothing passes is to divide the pilot group into haves and have-nots or try to vilify pilots who don't support initiatives that do nothing to make their own lives better. Look at TA2, there were no special interests who won out over the pilot group at-large and the contract passed with overwhelming support. The current MEC and many posters here seem intent on getting their piece of the pie at the expense of the rest of the pilot group. If that's the way our negotiators go management will win because it will set pilot against pilot and we won't have a contract for years.
Can you not see the conflict in your last two paragraphs? In the first one you are advocating just what you are vilifying in the next!!! You are advocating that a special interest group (one that has other options for their healthcare) get a benefit that the majority cannot. Just because this special interest group might opt out of medical coverage doesn’t mean it’s not a negotiated benefit for them. One that they have access to if needed.
I don't think I am missing your point at all. I'm dealing with the reality of getting a contract that can pass memrat. If C19 turns into a special interest land grab it will never pass.
Denny
08-23-2018, 09:38 AM
#38
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2010
Position: 320B
Posts: 369
Can I get the same type of kick back for not using paid parking? (commuter at non Delta station)
I asked about this a month or so ago and was told to pound sand, now when it affects specific individuals their perspectives change....(not you specifically but that was the general gist)
I asked about this a month or so ago and was told to pound sand, now when it affects specific individuals their perspectives change....(not you specifically but that was the general gist)
08-23-2018, 10:00 AM
#39
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 99
So talking to a SWA buddy it seems like they have much better medical benefits. One thing is that they have a “no cost” option to the employee. It may not be the lowest total out of pocket option but still better than a stick in the eye.
This is something that would benefit all of the pilots as there are plenty of us out there who are otherwise covered through TRICARE or a spouses plan.
The other option would be some sort of kickback from the company for declining medical insurance as that saves them money so why not split that savings with the employee?
This is something that would benefit all of the pilots as there are plenty of us out there who are otherwise covered through TRICARE or a spouses plan.
The other option would be some sort of kickback from the company for declining medical insurance as that saves them money so why not split that savings with the employee?
08-23-2018, 11:51 AM
#40
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,588
Are you taxed on that $58.50 a month?
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