C Series Info
08-02-2019, 12:39 PM
#3722
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Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
It bumps the bypass ratio of a 321 from 5:1 to 12:1, maintenance cost down 20%, noise reduction of up to 80% and fuel drops 20% on a 321Neo over the CEO.
Range on a 321 increases 500nm and it can carry 2 tons more payload. Then they add in the extra tank on the long range versions and the thing gets a silly long range. But just with the engine fuel burn alone WOW airlines was able to fly Reykjavik to Lax with the same tanks as a standard 319/320/321 share.
The 220 has the smaller GTF pw engine. I assume the same, the big reduction in fuel burn is the engine
Cool website from PW.
https://pwgtf.com/
08-02-2019, 12:51 PM
#3723
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Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
The A220 is discounted an additional 20% off due to the tax write off. Then, there is the reduced maintenance cost of a new aircraft/MRO, the significantly less fuel burn, and the economy of scale with the -300. There is also the additional revenue opportunity because the A221 is a far more capable aircraft.
08-02-2019, 07:18 PM
#3724
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Joined APC: Sep 2009
Posts: 282
We actually did acquire the E90's (from AC) but then immediately flipped them, I'm told, at a profit.
But what if the market is only 80 seats and it's a 109 seater? Could a 76 seater be more profitable?
I think delta and cseries fans love to talk about the range and fuel efficiency because it's there, but Delta was about to acquire E190s for the job. That is until the CS1 price drop and/or someone at Embraer really personally ****ed off Ed as is rumored.
I think the mission for it is still to upgauge and control of a large portion of the product and fuel efficiency is a side benefit... unless gtf engines keep being a problem.
If fuel efficiency was the mission we would dump A221s for 223s but we just ordered more 221s.
So i bet, and it's my bet, the A220 gets used in ways that make sense, but also in ways that make no sense at all unless you think of it as a jumbo RJ market replacement.
I think delta and cseries fans love to talk about the range and fuel efficiency because it's there, but Delta was about to acquire E190s for the job. That is until the CS1 price drop and/or someone at Embraer really personally ****ed off Ed as is rumored.
I think the mission for it is still to upgauge and control of a large portion of the product and fuel efficiency is a side benefit... unless gtf engines keep being a problem.
If fuel efficiency was the mission we would dump A221s for 223s but we just ordered more 221s.
So i bet, and it's my bet, the A220 gets used in ways that make sense, but also in ways that make no sense at all unless you think of it as a jumbo RJ market replacement.
08-06-2019, 08:06 AM
#3726
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Joined APC: Jul 2010
Position: window seat
Posts: 12,544
Cool, assuming everything is properly accounted for. Does the CASM include a potentially much shorter TBO of very expensive engines though? That could move the needle quite a bit.
08-06-2019, 08:10 AM
#3727
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Joined APC: Jul 2010
Position: window seat
Posts: 12,544
That may be the residual at the moment, but unless the market is willing to pay that for all of them (highly unlikely) then that number will fall to market rates instantly. Maybe SWA is on the hook for that with no way out, I don't know. But there's no way Hawaiian and Qantas and the one or two micro LCC's around the world will absorb 90+ of those things at that price either. Not even close to that amount.
08-06-2019, 08:12 AM
#3728
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Joined APC: Jul 2010
Position: window seat
Posts: 12,544
Sounds like a good opportunity to switch out "flagships" possibly combined with a MAX order a year or so after they're flying for everyone else again...
08-06-2019, 08:26 AM
#3729
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Joined APC: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,339
That may be the residual at the moment, but unless the market is willing to pay that for all of them (highly unlikely) then that number will fall to market rates instantly. Maybe SWA is on the hook for that with no way out, I don't know. But there's no way Hawaiian and Qantas and the one or two micro LCC's around the world will absorb 90+ of those things at that price either. Not even close to that amount.
08-06-2019, 08:29 AM
#3730
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Joined APC: Jul 2010
Position: window seat
Posts: 12,544
Not sure what those options are, but I'm sure there's a number on the 717's somewhere much lower than 17M that could incentivize DL to keep them. Putting all the bottom end lift eggs in the C Series (Fauxbus) basket with already known engine issues on a still very unproven platform (lol Baltic and Swiss microfleets, sure) would be very risky if everything doesn't pan out perfectly.
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