Red Forman

I love the idiots still wearing one around their chin.

Red Forman

You have it backwards, but go on...

JohnBurke

I do not disagree.

Denial of science does not invalidate the science, nor does quackery alter the science; only the perceptions of those stupid enough to follow the quack.

Hubcapped

are you saying covid deaths during the first couple strains are lies?

Excargodog

I think what he is saying is that even a cold can kill people - especially elderly people. That was recognized long before COVID.

https://www.aafp.org/pubs/afp/issues/2001/0115/p257.
html

An excerpt:

There are four other relatively common coronavirus infections that do just cause colds, but people at risk can die of colds too.

JohnBurke

Co-morbidities associated with the demographic most affected by Covid ran along similar lines; many of the deaths were complications of pneumonia that was wrought on by the initial Covid infection, but Covid also caused a number of other problems that do not accompany most other common illness-inducing pathogens. The immuno-response from many victims was actually what caused the bulk of the life-threatening problems, and these typically in people with weakened constitutions, older, etc.

The danger of the dismissive "chi-flu" and other attempts to call Covid just a cold or flu is that covid didn't replace either one; the deaths were in addition to. The only reason that a decrease in total deaths or hospitalizations due to other conditions was the degree of isolation, masking, and distancing that was taking place. The rate of spread and the degree of contaigen with Covid, vs. other pathogens was considerably higher. Additionally, while the annual flu season, and respiratory infections such as RSV, as well as pneumonia do account for a number of deaths and hospitalizations, they do not result in the rapid buildup of victims, or tend to overwhelm medical facilities, and certainly not on the scale we saw with Covid. Not remotely close.

The regional hospitals here had multiple refrigeration units to handle corpses, with ICU's at capacity and additional emergency facilities involved. Respirators were stretched thin. My own AME, a pulmonary specialist, was run ragged dealing with a very high elevated case load; he's been in the business for a long time, and said he's never seen anything like that. Other physicians with whom I spoke had very similar accounts.

Most of us, when we did get Covid, had anything from no signs or symptoms to mild to moderate flu-like responses, as well as some with the ubiquitous loss of taste or smell, etc. One of my boys got it two years ago and still can't taste or smell. When I got it, it was as things had wound down, travel opened up, and I'd made it through flying hot and heavy through the pandemic, a lot of flights into all the Covid hotspots around the world, without a hint of a problem. When I did get it, however, I got quite sick. A neighbor got it, and spent months in ICU. The responses varied widely. Another friend got it; she was down for about five months, including several months of touch-and-go hospitalization. The disease was very real.

Cold are real. Flu variants are real. Pneumonia is real, and people do die of the flu and pneumonia. Peole die from Covid and Covid-related complications too, but not in lieu of influenza or pneumonia, but in addition to, or in many cases, Covid ends up seeing pneumonia as an additional complication.

I stopped being bulletproof a long time ago. I'm a "high risk" category person, as is my wife. I'm not a particularly valuable person; if I get sick and die, it won't matter much to the world, and I'm not vain enough to think that I matter all that much, but a common-sense approach to me is valid, taking every precaution, including vaccinations, masking where appropriate, avoiding large gatherings where possible, while still living a normal life, is my way of addressing it. If I get it and die or am disabled because of it, so be it, but that will only happen after I've done whatever I can do to exercise common sense and care. Likewise, if I do get it, I will isolate, just as I did before, and take great care not to pass it along to anyone else. If this offends others, the meter has yet to be invented to measure my indifference, and likewise, I couldn't care less what others choose to do. Let others take precautions as they see fit, or not. The only cases in which I do take offense are those who know they are infected or contagious, and yet go into the world carelessly, without any concern for others. Those, I'd be more than happy to drop-kick over the fifty-yard line.

Hubcapped

I wish this dude would pay me rent for all the time i spend in his head. Pretty funny to ask someone a question and get a response from someone totally different. I guess if we keep this up, he’ll get thrashed so much that over time, this thread will become him showcasing his rampant insecurities by yelling into the clouds 4 cut and pastes in a row.


early covid was not the same as any cold or flu. The statistics don’t support that. You can use right wing extremist clickbait bullcrap to feed your bias, or data from the .gov. There is a middle ground.

flu deaths average about 40k a year.
2020 covid deaths was 350k. Even if some magical insane conspiracy that would have required thousands and thousands of people to collaborate, and thus these numbers are off by 50%, thats still almost a 400% increase in mortality.

disregarding reality is a sign of psychosis. You guys are ridiculous

Excargodog

The INITIAL exposure to COVID was NOT the same as any cold or flu because it was a NOVEL coronavirusthat no one had been exposed to - hence the statement that the preferred FIRST exposure was by immunization. But the other coronaviruses were likely equally pathogenic when they first jumped from the animal world to the human world. Same thing for the novel strains of influenza, despite long human exposure to influenza. Why you choose to call CDC sites and American Association of Family Practitioner sites "right wing extremist bull crap" I have no idea, but it doesn't sound like you are claiming any sort of "middle ground" by doing so.

Facts are facts no matter if you like them or not.

MaxQ

Good post. I predict it will be ignored.

Glad you pointed out that the number of deaths increased by essientially the same number of deaths that were attributed to COVID.

I know next to nothing about medicine. However, I can do numbers.
When I bothered to track it (using world stats and comparing total infections to deaths from COVID and those determined to be recovered) the early death rate was about 5% to 7%. After the initial surge it settled into a steady 2%. That lasted until the vaccine came out. The numbers quickly dropped below 1% and after a while I stopped tracking it.

While 2% isn't exactly ebola, it was certainly worse odds than most people in our modern world should consider acceptable.
I have some opinions about why certain media drivers of public opinion took the positions they did, but it is conjecture on my part. What is not conjecture is that what the appropriate public health policies should have been were quickly politicized by some. Once that occured, any attempts to make coherent policy was doomed by chaos. We don't know what worked well, what didn't work well, etc because there was too much discord between state govts, media outlets, and the conclusion predestination of the dunning kruger internet educated.

I suspect that due to the vitriol, the deliberate efforts of powerful media personalities to vilify rather than enlighten, any future public health crisis will be more difficult to respond to by a factor of several magnitudes.

I am, however, personally grateful for all readers who survived their battles with small-pox and polio.
Oh.That's right. Never mind. If you are younger than me you never had them.
Just lucky, I guess.

Hubcapped

what are you talking about? If youre going to be so immature and answer questions directed at other people maybe track the conversation. Here let me help you:
-new virus in china, goggles tweaks and makes a joke that severely demonstrates his lack of knowledge regarding the initial COVID scenario.
-i poke him for that.
-red says it was a cold.
-it was statistically not a cold.

no one talking about current strains

why is this always hard for you?

first and last months rent up front. HOA fees are 69$, the lady in 3b is a little cooky, but dont look her in the eyes and its ok. Street parking