USMCFDX

My question is why are we disputing the same kind of trips after our new contract that we were disputing with our old contract. Why did we not fix the problem? I was all for leaving them in open time during contract talks, and until a few days ago I too was of the opinion that they should still stay in open time.

But I have to say now I am more inclined to agree with Open Mind. The trip is legal, by the contract and by FARs. Is it a good trip? No, but neither is ONT-MEM-ONT. Try flying a week of those and see how you feel.

TonyC

Would you be in favor of disbanding the SIG and asking The Company to turn the Optimizer on full blast?



We have a tool that CAN be used to protect us, even if its influence is small and its powers few. That's all we have -- are you suggesting we undermine what little we have?







.

Purple F/O

There are a couple of issues here. First of all, regarding your last sentence...never fly fatigued. It is not only unsafe, but unfair to your crew if you're 'not in the game.' The contract addresses fatigue now, be sure to follow it's guidance.

Overall, we did get some improvements in the contract to try to rid ourselves of the DPs...the problem is, there are many ways to Optimize our scheduling. To think that the pilot group can think of, much less get the company to agree to regulate all of them would be naive of us.

The dispute process allows us, contractually, to act in a way that can improve our safety and QOL. We are afforded very few of those actions 'legally,' so I think we should take advantage of them when we can.

Bottom line is the SIG works pretty damn hard to ID these pairings and pursuade the company to change them. We can help them by not flying DPs voluntarily. If we choose to fly them, we therefore castrate the SIG and it's bargaining power...which they use to make improvements for us...as a group.

Small but important point here. There may be some occasional DPs that appeal to a small group. Perhaps a DH post critical-flight, which is from your hometown. It's disputed to benefit the whole pilot group. If you, for instance, live in that DH city and think, 'this DP doesn't apply to me because I'm not taking the D/H,' then you're wrong. Please look past the short term gain and help us improve our schedules across the board.

FR8Hauler

The SIG is one of the few contractual ways we can improve our QOL. HNL-LAX then deadheading to OAK two hours later may sound good to some but it is only the beginning. Let them do this and then we will have CDG-EWR then two hours later deadhead to MEM I guarantee you. Guess what, you won't get paid for it either because it will be the same duty day.

FR8Hauler

You do have a valid point about why any resevre should be allowed to fly these and I agree with that. However, that is the way it is under this contract. THE REST OF US CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE if we do not ***** ourselves. If a guy is picking up extra flying with DP's(which I can't get because I do not fly DP's)he does not need landings, and I will be happy to take all of them. I can always use a few more for my proficency.

Purple F/O

Two things about reserve guys flying DPs.

1. The company and the union agree on the idea that the freight has to move. That's how FDX makes money and we get our paychecks. You'll notice lots of nuances in the contract that allow the company lots of leeway to make this happen. The base assignment trick, field extension etc.
Even the GPE in the new contract was a melded combination of 'the freight has got to move ... but if you dick with our shedules then you should pay for it.' It's a win-win combination if you ask me...which you didn't.

2. The company and the union also agree that a reservist is willing to fly 'any trip.' This is why you don't get disruption pay as a reservist. On this I disagree to the point that a reservist has agreed to fly 'any bidpack trip,' and therefore feel the disruption should apply to reservists too(at a minimum, the changes after assigment should be subject to disruption), but I don't get to make that decision. Anyway, this reservist mentality allows the DPs to get flown, but also allows us some leverage to make the company work to get them flown. People who voluntarily fly them short-circuit this leverage that we have. They are essentially flying trips that the crew force has agreed not to fly as a group. Not quite flying struck cargo, but perhaps the step-brother-in-law twice removed by marriage to flying struck cargo.

I report, you decide.

USMCFDX

Purple:

I don't fly fatigued, does not bother me at all to make that call.

What kind of leverage are we getting and what exactly are we trying to leverage? Like you said the company needs to move the freight and they can schedule however they want within the contractral rules

We should have fixed the reserve disruption in the new contract. I guess we got the added retirement percentage multiplier for those older retired military guys that got to FedEx too late instead.

Tony:

No I do not want the optimizer turned up, but I don't think we can stop it if we wanted to. It is and will continue to ramp up.

The SIG does good work and I think that there is a good amount of coperation recently between them and the company. But bottom line their powers are nil if the contract says it is legal, all they can do is try to influence the build.

Magenta Line

Nicely put, fr8hauler.

Mr. Nail, meet Mr. Head.

And the said thing is there will be IDIOTS that will think that's OK to fly (CDG-EWR-DH MEM).

Open Mind

Saying that I just don't get it, is an easy way of avoiding an opinion you just don't like!!! The Sig ltr of Agreement doesn't say that only reserves should fly disputed prgs. Not flying DP prgs is a show of support for the SIG...similar to buying a hat and wearing a lanyard was a show of support for the Negotiating committee. Each individual has a right to decide. Your choice doesn't make you anything other than a dues paying member if you are. If you didn't buy a hat, how can you critize someone else's choice. Reread the ltr of agreement, many statements in this thread are simply false!!!

Purple F/O

Didn't mean to sound as if I were lecturing on fatigue...apologies if I did.

Re: Optimization--Think No city purity, think No trip-rig trips, think No rest period between the revenue and deadhead portion of trips, think about evertime you're beat down at the end of a duty period and then think about them squeezing another couple of hours or another leg out of you.

What can we do to stop optimization? We can start by honoring the SIGs request to not fly DPs.