MH Shootdown FDX
07-25-2014, 01:40 AM
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2005
Position: tri current
Posts: 1,485
Sorry to intrude, but what is the problem with Iran? I've flown over Iran, and into Tehran, as an American for over 11 years. Never a problem.
Agree with the sentiment about company scheduling overflights of war zones. There is no way, we as pilots, can know where all the hot spots are and whether they have the capability to shoot down an airliner at altitude. That responsibility falls on the company.
I for one had no idea of the number of helicopters, fighters, etc shot down in the Ukraine immediately prior to Malaysian. A good friend of mine flew the exact route 24 hours prior to Malaysian. To say he was a little unnerved is an understatement.
I think this incident will be a wake up call for many airlines. I doubt they really understood the threat. Why would they?, we didn't. Now that the wake up call has happened I would expect all airlines to be a little more cautious.
Typhoonpilot
Agree with the sentiment about company scheduling overflights of war zones. There is no way, we as pilots, can know where all the hot spots are and whether they have the capability to shoot down an airliner at altitude. That responsibility falls on the company.
I for one had no idea of the number of helicopters, fighters, etc shot down in the Ukraine immediately prior to Malaysian. A good friend of mine flew the exact route 24 hours prior to Malaysian. To say he was a little unnerved is an understatement.
I think this incident will be a wake up call for many airlines. I doubt they really understood the threat. Why would they?, we didn't. Now that the wake up call has happened I would expect all airlines to be a little more cautious.
Typhoonpilot
07-25-2014, 05:05 AM
#12
Line Holder
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Posts: 62
I for one was taken back by the comment "We have not flown over that region since Feb". I have but I did not overfly the restricted airspace issued in the 23 APR FAA advisory #113. Where did Feb come from? By the way I only learned of this restriction via an ALPA email not by the company and always checked my flight plan to ensure we did not overfly this area. I overflew the exact area of the shoot down in the 2nd week of July.
07-25-2014, 02:03 PM
#13
Working weekends
Joined APC: Jul 2005
Position: Left Seat
Posts: 2,384
Sorry to intrude, but what is the problem with Iran? I've flown over Iran, and into Tehran, as an American for over 11 years. Never a problem.
Agree with the sentiment about company scheduling overflights of war zones. There is no way, we as pilots, can know where all the hot spots are and whether they have the capability to shoot down an airliner at altitude. That responsibility falls on the company.
I for one had no idea of the number of helicopters, fighters, etc shot down in the Ukraine immediately prior to Malaysian. A good friend of mine flew the exact route 24 hours prior to Malaysian. To say he was a little unnerved is an understatement.
I think this incident will be a wake up call for many airlines. I doubt they really understood the threat. Why would they?, we didn't. Now that the wake up call has happened I would expect all airlines to be a little more cautious.
Typhoonpilot
Agree with the sentiment about company scheduling overflights of war zones. There is no way, we as pilots, can know where all the hot spots are and whether they have the capability to shoot down an airliner at altitude. That responsibility falls on the company.
I for one had no idea of the number of helicopters, fighters, etc shot down in the Ukraine immediately prior to Malaysian. A good friend of mine flew the exact route 24 hours prior to Malaysian. To say he was a little unnerved is an understatement.
I think this incident will be a wake up call for many airlines. I doubt they really understood the threat. Why would they?, we didn't. Now that the wake up call has happened I would expect all airlines to be a little more cautious.
Typhoonpilot
Also, I think Iran, Russia are smart enought not to blast you out of the sky. Fighter escort, yes. North Korea, Syria, Afghan, Iraq, too many cave-man terrorist a-holes and probably should never fly over those areas.
07-25-2014, 02:53 PM
#14
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: Continuing The Dream
Posts: 161
Ladies and Gentlemen:
The epitome of transparency, morality, and true ethics is being able to stand up behind any official statement as truth, honesty, and verifiability. Either our System Chief Pilot is uninformed, misinformed, he failed to do his due diligence, or he’s a puppet of the Hacks Cross string manipulators.
Have you noticed the first MH 17 statement published by our SCP is no longer accessible? I often go back and re-read different notes published by the Company – FOM 55 highlights, or the IND Domicile Bid, to glean any tidbit of information I can that’ll help me perform my job at FedEx better. So, when I went back to review the MH 17 note, I discovered it’s no longer accessible – the entirety of the note.
Specifically, I was looking for the comment [he] made indicating FedEx aircraft had NOT been flight planned through the airspace over Ukraine since February (the commencement of hostilities). I was VERY proud FDX Corp had taken the position to not subject the crew force to any danger in a war zone where significant SAM threats exist. Though I don’t typically operate EU-Asia flights, we all have friends that do. So, when I was sitting at the evening discussion table in Guangzhou and was told by one of our crew members we’re STILL operating along that exact route, and routes near it, I countered his comment with the statement made by our System Chief Pilot. Then I thought, who happens to be correct, the crewmember operating the flight, or the SCP putting out some eyewash statement. Now the complete statement is missing and not linkable for review. In the Singapore Sunday Times of 20 JULY 2014, [they] listed the carriers and frequency of flights the week prior [to the shoot-down] that had operated along the route where MH 17 was lost – FedEx was listed with 5 flights.
Many others flew same route
So – was the eyewash for our benefit? Was the eyewash for his benefit? Did the Hacks Cross attorneys encourage our SCP to publish a statement they had drafted? Does anybody on Democrat or Hacks Cross even believe credibility might be an issue? Is there any validity to the NEW missive our SCP has posted?
The transparency, morality, ethics, honesty and most critical aspect of our operation – SAFETY – has been lost. QA guy … come join me on a flight. I’ve got some questions to ask! Oh … and bring a sweater.
Very Respectfully,
Nakazawa
The epitome of transparency, morality, and true ethics is being able to stand up behind any official statement as truth, honesty, and verifiability. Either our System Chief Pilot is uninformed, misinformed, he failed to do his due diligence, or he’s a puppet of the Hacks Cross string manipulators.
Have you noticed the first MH 17 statement published by our SCP is no longer accessible? I often go back and re-read different notes published by the Company – FOM 55 highlights, or the IND Domicile Bid, to glean any tidbit of information I can that’ll help me perform my job at FedEx better. So, when I went back to review the MH 17 note, I discovered it’s no longer accessible – the entirety of the note.
Specifically, I was looking for the comment [he] made indicating FedEx aircraft had NOT been flight planned through the airspace over Ukraine since February (the commencement of hostilities). I was VERY proud FDX Corp had taken the position to not subject the crew force to any danger in a war zone where significant SAM threats exist. Though I don’t typically operate EU-Asia flights, we all have friends that do. So, when I was sitting at the evening discussion table in Guangzhou and was told by one of our crew members we’re STILL operating along that exact route, and routes near it, I countered his comment with the statement made by our System Chief Pilot. Then I thought, who happens to be correct, the crewmember operating the flight, or the SCP putting out some eyewash statement. Now the complete statement is missing and not linkable for review. In the Singapore Sunday Times of 20 JULY 2014, [they] listed the carriers and frequency of flights the week prior [to the shoot-down] that had operated along the route where MH 17 was lost – FedEx was listed with 5 flights.
Many others flew same route
So – was the eyewash for our benefit? Was the eyewash for his benefit? Did the Hacks Cross attorneys encourage our SCP to publish a statement they had drafted? Does anybody on Democrat or Hacks Cross even believe credibility might be an issue? Is there any validity to the NEW missive our SCP has posted?
The transparency, morality, ethics, honesty and most critical aspect of our operation – SAFETY – has been lost. QA guy … come join me on a flight. I’ve got some questions to ask! Oh … and bring a sweater.
Very Respectfully,
Nakazawa
07-25-2014, 03:30 PM
#16
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2006
Position: 767 CA
Posts: 1,876
Ladies and Gentlemen:
The epitome of transparency, morality, and true ethics is being able to stand up behind any official statement as truth, honesty, and verifiability. Either our System Chief Pilot is uninformed, misinformed, he failed to do his due diligence, or he’s a puppet of the Hacks Cross string manipulators.
The epitome of transparency, morality, and true ethics is being able to stand up behind any official statement as truth, honesty, and verifiability. Either our System Chief Pilot is uninformed, misinformed, he failed to do his due diligence, or he’s a puppet of the Hacks Cross string manipulators.
Where does this fall in the our new Just Culture environment?
07-25-2014, 07:39 PM
#18
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2005
Posts: 170
It was shot down on July 17, not July 18, as the SCP days. There are other obvious typos in the missive as well.
They had to come clean. Crews knew where they had been flying! I suspect he was misinformed, not covering anything up on purpose. But rather than admitting the error, he just writes over with new info.
That lacks integrity.
They had to come clean. Crews knew where they had been flying! I suspect he was misinformed, not covering anything up on purpose. But rather than admitting the error, he just writes over with new info.
That lacks integrity.
07-26-2014, 04:00 AM
#20
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Position: Retired
Posts: 3,717
Nakazawa,
That's exactly what the Print Screen, or print key is for. You guys should be making hard copies of provocative FCIF's, emails, etc, so that when they magically disappear, you still have them for future reference. It's the least you can do, and never let it be said that you didn't do the least you can do.
That's exactly what the Print Screen, or print key is for. You guys should be making hard copies of provocative FCIF's, emails, etc, so that when they magically disappear, you still have them for future reference. It's the least you can do, and never let it be said that you didn't do the least you can do.
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