China Southern so cheap they wont deice
#71
Am I the only one thinking- Man, we have been wasting a huge amount of money and time on this whole deicing business- after seeing this? I saw that Russian Airbus video a few months ago, and now this. ***? I thought something like one-one-millionth of a centimeter of frost can reduce your lift by 800%. Maybe the deicing fluid industry is in bed with the FAA? Screw it, I'm not wasting any more time at the deice pad ever again. I'm going 'Chinese Style'!
MG2
#73
Am I the only one thinking- Man, we have been wasting a huge amount of money and time on this whole deicing business- after seeing this? I saw that Russian Airbus video a few months ago, and now this. ***? I thought something like one-one-millionth of a centimeter of frost can reduce your lift by 800%. Maybe the deicing fluid industry is in bed with the FAA? Screw it, I'm not wasting any more time at the deice pad ever again. I'm going 'Chinese Style'!
#74
Correct. The real problem wasn't ice on the wings, it was ice on the EPR probes due to the crew not turning on engine anti-ice. Actual thrust at T/O was something like 60%. Ice on the wings didn't help.
#75
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: MD-11 Guru
Posts: 208
Between the power setting mentioned above and the MD-80 wing having issues, we have waaay too many procedures and derivatives of fluid formulas. Common sense, what? no! We need to deice every single aircraft with type IV safeco double deluxe industrial hold anytime Ewins says there could be a 5 minute delay due to frost for the night sort........and fly into the sort no matter what, even if there is 6 inches of clear ice in the forecast.....
#76
I work in Japan, not China mind you but I do fly in and out of China a lot. For what I have seen (and I couldn't care less, not defending anybody) airlines in China tend to be way too conservative in terms of their de-icing, I have seen them de ice even when there is no need to. I have a feeling there is a problem with this particular crew and not necessarily with the company's safety culture per say.
#77
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: MD-11
Posts: 395
You have to wonder, with respect to CZ, what else they miss because they obviously do not understand the physics behind flying airplanes. Typical push button mentality of these fly-by-night airlines.
So, does ALPA have any input into what carriers we deadhead on? Isn't safety our number one priority (or is it VEBA, I get confused sometimes).
#78
Am I the only one thinking- Man, we have been wasting a huge amount of money and time on this whole deicing business- after seeing this? I saw that Russian Airbus video a few months ago, and now this. ***? I thought something like one-one-millionth of a centimeter of frost can reduce your lift by 800%. Maybe the deicing fluid industry is in bed with the FAA? Screw it, I'm not wasting any more time at the deice pad ever again. I'm going 'Chinese Style'!
#79
just past ETP
Joined APC: Sep 2012
Position: Cruise Captain
Posts: 507
add Aeroflot to your list.. when I was at Gemini we had a few airlines on our no-fly list, and those were two... As a side note, I flew into Almaty Kazakstan quite a bit and they'd always look at us strange when we wanted to de-ice our 747's when they had some frost on the wings... some would actually try to argue we didn't need it... sigh.
#80
When I was at Polar we had the same problem with China Airlines... After the report the only Chinese airline allowed for DHDs was Cathay. I would suggest you push for the same.
Heck even Korean was off the list.
Heck even Korean was off the list.
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