TonyC

I'm with Gunter -- give up nothing.

The very question itself assumes that we are chained to a zero-sum game. It assumes we have no control over the size of the pie -- we only get to decide how to divide it. It assumes that in order to gain a benefit, we must sacrifice a benefit.

I reject that notion.

We've earned more, we deserve more, we should feel no shame in demanding more. We shouldn't settle for the status quo, shouldn't settle for zero sum, shouldn't give up benefits earned in order to gain benefits deserved.

We deserve a bigger pie.






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trashhauler

Ah Tony, if it were only that easy. You of all people should know that we don't get what we deserve, we get what we negotiate! Before you jump on me, I agree we deserve a bigger piece of the pie without having to give anything up. That being said, we need a big stick to negotiate that and that means a united front. Unfortunately, I haven't seen that yet. Hopefully that will change, we'll see

Popeye

Tony,

My comment regarding giving something up was more sarcasm than negotiating advice. I am on record for not having much interest in spending anything to fix what a marjority have decided is best. I am, however, very sympathetic toward those that have been put through the ringer and think there should be far more done on their behalf. Trashhauler seems to have captured my sentiment of negotiating from a position of strength or weakness and getting what we deserve based on that.

That said, I doubt we'll be getting much for nothing. IMHO.

TonyC

We agree. We deserve more, and we won't get it until The Company is convinced that we won't settle for less. And it won't be easy.


And that brings us full circle to the critical role, the essential role of leadership. We won't get there without leadership that recognizes our worth, leadership which is guided by our goals, leadership which is dedicated to doing what it takes to achieve those goals.

Leadership which attempts to lower our expectations by fretting over an uncertain economy (despite our own Company's continued wild success) won't get us there. Leadership which is less concerned about whether our goals are achieved in negotiations, and more concerned about how the two parties will feel about each other after the negotiations are complete won't get us there. Leadership which repeats the "unity" mantra while doing nothing to inspire it won't get us there.

I heard a powerful speech about leadership last night, and couldn't help but think of some important parallels for us here at home. Having the courage to tell the truth. Having the courage to say "No" instead of "Yes" when "No" is required. Real leaders don't follow polls, real leaders change polls. If you ever expect to see this group of 4,600 independent opearators acting like a unified group, we need someone exercising real leadership.






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Unknown Rider

In other words, we should replace the current leadership?

4A2B

Man that is quite a sea change in from your past statements on pilot desires being followed by their reps! Sure sounds ,very much like... "you guys are all happy (relatively) only because you do not know what is best for you, so let me tell you what you want" . Rings reminiscent of past history at our Association, just saying.

HIFLYR

Name one time the former MEC said no. It is not like this is the first MEC to not say no.

Gunter

I've been told SS should be a strong leader like DW was.

I found it poor form when DW tried to inspire unity on the 777 issue by telling us not to bid it since it didn't have a pay rate, as he put his bid in for it. He had no apologies for that action.

If that's strong, decisive leadership I hope it stays away.

TonyC

I knew the word "poll" would evoke a kneejerk reaction -- I just didn't know who would be first, or how long it would take.

Of course, you assume that the speaker meant that real leaders should ignore polls. That's not what was said. Focus on the second half of the sentence and ponder what that means. What does it mean to change polls?

Of course, to change polls one must change the hearts and minds of those polled. How does a leader do that? They communicate. They educate. They tell the truth, even the hard truths, even the unpopular truths. In a word, they lead. They don't stick their finger in the air and determine the wind direction today, they evaluate all the facts and all the variables and they determine the best course of action, and then they persuade others to follow that path. That's leadership. That's leadership from the front.




About 6 years ago, a group of 12 courageous men said, "No", to discriminating against a small portion of pilots on our seniority list. The popular thing then was to cut them out of the ability to exercise one of their seniority rights, namely the right to bid for a vacant front seat. The MEC committed to defend those seniority rights for all pilots on the seniority list, they charged the Chairman to champion that position, and they affected the implementation of the regulated age change.


Before you accuse them of ignoring a poll ... there was no poll on that issue. The MEC didn't need to stick their fingers in the air ... they knew what the right thing to do was.


(And lest you think I might be patting myself on the back, no ... that was before my time.)


Sure, there were plenty of times when we've fallen short. But let's not let that be an excuse for lowering our expectations in the future. If we don't aim for excellence, we shouldn't be surprised or disappointed when we don't achieve it.






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TonyC

Unfortunately, it's not that simple.

There are two parts to that process -- getting somebody out, and getting somebody in. If the somebody in is no better than the somebody out, replacing doesn't fix anything.


If the people in place now decide to actually lead, that would fix the problem, too. I'm open to that.






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