Recall of CA Baker and CA Hauserman - 15 Feb
02-10-2012, 06:10 AM
#36
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Position: 777
Posts: 866
Sorry folks,
But these guys "volunteer" for these thankless positions. So if they do get a small perk once in a while... I for one say good for you.
And if they don't get any beenies for all their time.....Why Not???
To all the union volunteers: Thanks for your time and effort at making MY life better...
But these guys "volunteer" for these thankless positions. So if they do get a small perk once in a while... I for one say good for you.
And if they don't get any beenies for all their time.....Why Not???
To all the union volunteers: Thanks for your time and effort at making MY life better...
02-10-2012, 07:21 AM
#37
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2006
Posts: 2,889
I wore the suits for 4 days a pop once a quarter, plus a special meeting now and then. No matter how ****ty the trip that got dropped for the meeting was, but Friday the necktie was chafing me and the frustration of working in a committee environment made me long to get back to the line.
What do YOU do on layovers? I work out now and then, sometimes work with clients, eat when I want where I want, and can eat or sleep on my own schedule. Also--as a line holder--if I want to plus up my days with makeup or scale them down by dropping a trip I can do that. When a guy gets a month of flying bought, he pretty much owes that many days to the union. His calendar is not his own. Flex guys get a few golden days off--but at the union if something important pops up your ass is there. My own experience on both the MEC and committee is that the days start early, run all day, and often are followed by "social/business" meetings over dinner that night. The time you have IS NOT yours when you are working in that environment. The BEST thing about being an airline pilot--besides the view--is the fact when we aren't flying the free time is ours. Union committee people surrender that time.
If you think its a good deal...then for God's sake sign up and go get some of that FREE STUFF! Drop that hub turn, grab a suit, and go enjoy that office work. It is a good fit for some people, but for some--like me--I found it chafing and tiresome to always be worried about problems, issues, and strategies. It wasn't the workload that wore you down, it was constantly having to be concerned with the issues, problems, and personalities that go into the behind the scenes efforts. We all have our gripes with this profession, but the autonomy we have pretty much spoils us quickly and the idea of having to go work for anyone else on THEIR timetable is suddenly very stifling.
The guys who step up to serve...both in the union and in flight management...surrender a of the control of their lives. On the management side, at least their are financial perks and incentives. It still takes someone who really is willing to do the tough job to step up, even if there is money involved, and those guys have my respect for taking on the task. On the union side, we have tons of policies and protections to make sure that no one "benefits" from the service. There is not supposed to be a financial incentive to serve. The result is we attract those who are doing it out of either A) a sincere desire to serve or B) the desire to have a personal impact on the crew force or C) the guy who needs to feel validated by having a position of authority or influence or D) a guy who is uncomfortable in his primary job and wants to minimize his exposure to same. What we don't have is a guy trying to get rich or screw the pilot force. I saw a bit of off types in my tenure, but am quite confident about 95% of the guys I met were doing it for A & B. As long as a guy does a good job, even if here is there for reasons C & D I could care less.
So...from my perspective...from 2008-2011 I didn't see a lot of problems. I didn't always agree with every person, and I have said many times there were times that in hindsight I was wrong on some issues. However, I also never saw any graft or abuse by committee folks either, but was instead constantly humbled by their efforts.
I think the crew force is smart enough to make their own assessments. That said, I have always been available and prided myself on being transparent and available. I'm in VIPS. I'm not in LEC 7 or 22, so I have no vote nor proxy in this effort. But I can tell you that I have confidence and trust in every committee chair I've dealt with in my term, and I'm hopeful that despite this latest politically driven BS that they will stay on and continue to serve us honorably. I'm glad they are doing those jobs that I damn sure don't want to have to take on myself, and I know they are doing them for the right reasons.
What do YOU do on layovers? I work out now and then, sometimes work with clients, eat when I want where I want, and can eat or sleep on my own schedule. Also--as a line holder--if I want to plus up my days with makeup or scale them down by dropping a trip I can do that. When a guy gets a month of flying bought, he pretty much owes that many days to the union. His calendar is not his own. Flex guys get a few golden days off--but at the union if something important pops up your ass is there. My own experience on both the MEC and committee is that the days start early, run all day, and often are followed by "social/business" meetings over dinner that night. The time you have IS NOT yours when you are working in that environment. The BEST thing about being an airline pilot--besides the view--is the fact when we aren't flying the free time is ours. Union committee people surrender that time.
If you think its a good deal...then for God's sake sign up and go get some of that FREE STUFF! Drop that hub turn, grab a suit, and go enjoy that office work. It is a good fit for some people, but for some--like me--I found it chafing and tiresome to always be worried about problems, issues, and strategies. It wasn't the workload that wore you down, it was constantly having to be concerned with the issues, problems, and personalities that go into the behind the scenes efforts. We all have our gripes with this profession, but the autonomy we have pretty much spoils us quickly and the idea of having to go work for anyone else on THEIR timetable is suddenly very stifling.
The guys who step up to serve...both in the union and in flight management...surrender a of the control of their lives. On the management side, at least their are financial perks and incentives. It still takes someone who really is willing to do the tough job to step up, even if there is money involved, and those guys have my respect for taking on the task. On the union side, we have tons of policies and protections to make sure that no one "benefits" from the service. There is not supposed to be a financial incentive to serve. The result is we attract those who are doing it out of either A) a sincere desire to serve or B) the desire to have a personal impact on the crew force or C) the guy who needs to feel validated by having a position of authority or influence or D) a guy who is uncomfortable in his primary job and wants to minimize his exposure to same. What we don't have is a guy trying to get rich or screw the pilot force. I saw a bit of off types in my tenure, but am quite confident about 95% of the guys I met were doing it for A & B. As long as a guy does a good job, even if here is there for reasons C & D I could care less.
So...from my perspective...from 2008-2011 I didn't see a lot of problems. I didn't always agree with every person, and I have said many times there were times that in hindsight I was wrong on some issues. However, I also never saw any graft or abuse by committee folks either, but was instead constantly humbled by their efforts.
I think the crew force is smart enough to make their own assessments. That said, I have always been available and prided myself on being transparent and available. I'm in VIPS. I'm not in LEC 7 or 22, so I have no vote nor proxy in this effort. But I can tell you that I have confidence and trust in every committee chair I've dealt with in my term, and I'm hopeful that despite this latest politically driven BS that they will stay on and continue to serve us honorably. I'm glad they are doing those jobs that I damn sure don't want to have to take on myself, and I know they are doing them for the right reasons.
02-10-2012, 07:39 AM
#38
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Posts: 90
Max-- you and I know each other and I consider you a friend. We have to disagree on this one.
The villification of committee members was pretty clear.
By the way, do you honestly believe TH and CB didn't know about the recall effort prior to the letter they reference in their latest mailing? Umm, they know well before as did most.
The villification of committee members was pretty clear.
By the way, do you honestly believe TH and CB didn't know about the recall effort prior to the letter they reference in their latest mailing? Umm, they know well before as did most.
02-10-2012, 11:21 AM
#39
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2006
Posts: 1,804
Sorry folks,
But these guys "volunteer" for these thankless positions. So if they do get a small perk once in a while... I for one say good for you.
And if they don't get any beenies for all their time.....Why Not???
To all the union volunteers: Thanks for your time and effort at making MY life better...
But these guys "volunteer" for these thankless positions. So if they do get a small perk once in a while... I for one say good for you.
And if they don't get any beenies for all their time.....Why Not???
To all the union volunteers: Thanks for your time and effort at making MY life better...
02-10-2012, 11:55 AM
#40
Line Holder
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Jan 2012
Position: First Officer
Posts: 40
We all have to judge whether the accused were taking liberty with their schedule or just trying not to get continually screwed because they are union volunteers. The investigation will not be complete by 15 Feb.
Did they in fact create for themselves "super" seniority due to their union position?
Did they work less than their removal? Do they actually work much more than what they get removed from?
It's a fact that block reps get less removal. They generally do not have much office duty. IMHO, It's easy to develop jealousy when you see committee members flying less than you as a block rep even though they actually work more days per month.
I'd rather the investigation happen then be told the results later. A McCarthy like atmosphere where accusations fly fast and loose for political gain demonstrates poor leadership. Our eyes are off the ball right now as we witness accusation after accusation. It's like a car wreck.
Did they in fact create for themselves "super" seniority due to their union position?
Did they work less than their removal? Do they actually work much more than what they get removed from?
It's a fact that block reps get less removal. They generally do not have much office duty. IMHO, It's easy to develop jealousy when you see committee members flying less than you as a block rep even though they actually work more days per month.
I'd rather the investigation happen then be told the results later. A McCarthy like atmosphere where accusations fly fast and loose for political gain demonstrates poor leadership. Our eyes are off the ball right now as we witness accusation after accusation. It's like a car wreck.
Last edited by FDX Block 8; 02-10-2012 at 01:54 PM.
