duvie

I've never really understood how the aviation department of delivery services is integrated with the company itself. Some of my questions may be way off, I'm definitely naive.

Operations like Fedex and UPS seem like the aircraft and crews are just as much as a part of the company like the trucks and their drivers. Is this an appropriate anology?

Companies like DHL and Airbone Express, which apparently are not seperate anymore, have what seems like a more seperate department for their aviation divisions. Do Abex and Astar operate seperately under contract for DHL/Airborne?

Also, a little off topic, but when you guys show up for work is it a pretty different environment than an airline because you're not under constant scrutiny of pax/FAs/gate agents? It seems like it would be a lot more mellow environment.

Any other information related to cargo ops is much appreciated.

V1VR

The integrated freight industry is quite different than the airline industry. However, there are not as many differences from the passenger side as you might think. We are not under scrutiny from passengers and don't have to deal with their issues. For example,turbulence does not rate high concern unless we have a planeload of horses and handlers, or we're flying nasty hazmat. Delays are not as common, no Flight Attendant issues arise. Security is a big concern, and we have alot of FFDO crews. We get our share of FAA rides, as many as anyone else.

I flew for TWA 5 years, this is much better, though the hours are usually tougher. But we're doing much more day flying now.

erichartmann

DHL (which is wholly owned subsidiary of Deutsche Post, and therefore a foreign company unable under law to own a U.S. airline) bought Airborne. Airborne and DHL, as part of the deal, spun off Airborne's wholly owned airline subsidiary ABX Air. ABX Air is now a publically traded U.S. airline under contract to DHL to haul freight.

Astar is the former DHL Airways. DHL used to be an independant U.S. based corporation and was thus able to own and operate a U.S. airline. This changed in the late 1990's when DHL sold itself overseas. At that time DHL Airways, which continued to operate under that name, was partially sold off to meet the requirements of U.S. law. Around the time DHL/DP bought Airborne DHL Airways was sold to an investment group headed by John Dasburg and the name was changed to Astar. Astar also has a contract with DHL to haul freight.

ABX currently operates approximately 100 aircraft, Astar about 40.

While there are no F/S's, gate agents, etc, there are loadmasters, ramp supers, station supers etc. Security can burdensome, and ranges from understandable if objectionable (I get screened leaving the airport - somebody in security thinks I'm stupid enough to risk a 6 figure income to steal an IPOD from the cargo) to absurd. Absurd involves screening pilots (to include FFDO's) for weapons to prevent them from using said weapons to gain access to the cockpit and take control of the aircraft. Duh!!! .

RedeyeAV8r

Be reasonable now........we don't want to have Pilots' taking over their own aircraft now do we??....

duvie

Thanks guys, that exactly what I wanted to know. So, DHL bought airborne and their aviation division. Since DHL is foreign owned they can't operate an airline of their own, so now they contract out to the old DHL airways AKA ABX and Astar which is Airbornes old air division. Gotcha.

Are both of these airlines are completely controlled by DHL?
Technically no, but in practice perhaps?
Wholly owned subsidiaries?

Is there speculation or actual credible evidence of those two companies becoming one?

When you guys fly, is there anybody else on the airplane besides the 2/3 guys up front?

Thanks for all the info

dckozak

Auburn Calloway!!

erichartmann

Yeah, but you still have all sorts of stuff on the aircraft that could be used as an improvised weapon, to say nothing of the crash ax. Besides, how many of you carry a maglite flashlight, or a mechancal pencil or pen. Those too could be used as weapons. Also, FFDO's are already armed. Not much point in searching an FFDO's suitcase/flightbag for a weapon!

erichartmann

ABX Air was the former wholly owned subsidiary airline for Airborne. It is now a publically traded independant corporation working under contract for DHL. ABX also has an active growing business as a contract carrier for others.

Astar is the former DHL Airways. They are privately held. They also have a contract to haul for DHL.

I guess that depends on what you mean by controlled. There is a contact. It has certain terms. Among them is a prohibition, in so many words, that prrevents us from doing any flying for Fedex or UPS. It allows DHL to specify which cities within the U.S. we fly to for DHL. DHL does not have all of ABX's aircraft under contact, and cannot tell us what to do with those it does not, nor can they tell us what cities we can fly to with those aircraft it has not contracted for.

There is always some speculation and or rumor. It would probably be cheaper for DHL to elminate the overhead of having two airlines flying for them in the U.S., but I personally doubt it will happen anytime soon. Doing so does not fit DHL/DP's current business model. This could change of course.

We carry ABX/Astar crewmembers commuting to/from ILN to work. We also carry specially approved company employees to and from various stations we serve on company business, and there are scheduled deadheads for some flights. We can also carry CASS approved crewmembers from carriers other than Astar, but that is relatively rare. Few people want to travel in the middle of the night on a freighter.

frozenboxhauler

Sometimes we'll carry State Dept. Couriers or Animal Handlers (if we are doing an animal charter,...mostly horses). Cargo is a "little" bit more relaxed than flying "self-loading trash". Top of climb, I change in to a silk bath robe and fuzzy slippers for the cruise portion.