Not painted Purple Yet! 767
06-25-2011, 09:39 AM
#32
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Joined APC: Apr 2006
Position: MD-11 Captain
Posts: 4,304
Ha! Although I'm generally inclined to agree with you, there was at least a small chance, that the 777 might pay A380 rates. At least that's what DW & BC kept saying (both of whom bid it without a payrate). I guess they were wrong?
06-25-2011, 02:28 PM
#33
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Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: Gear Monkey
Posts: 3,199
The IS&S cockpit configuration for our 757's is also available for the 767. ABX had/has it in their 767's. It would make more sense to put that configuration in the 767 if FDX wanted the current 757 pilots to fly the airplane.
I don't believe the FAA would allow the 777 crews to fly the 767 without a great deal more training in the type... As stated before there would only require some differences training for our 757 guys to fly the airplane since it is already a common type rating.
IF ... and it's a big if.. IF FDX decides to go the 767 route, that makes the most sense to me.
But... who says things have to make sense around here?
The pay seems like a fairly simple deal if our union negotiates it properly...
Narrow body pay for trips flown on the 757.. Wide Body pay for trips flown on the 767.
Reserve pay would have to be negotiated..
At other carriers flying both the 757 and 767, reserve is paid at the higher rate..
I don't believe the FAA would allow the 777 crews to fly the 767 without a great deal more training in the type... As stated before there would only require some differences training for our 757 guys to fly the airplane since it is already a common type rating.
IF ... and it's a big if.. IF FDX decides to go the 767 route, that makes the most sense to me.
But... who says things have to make sense around here?
The pay seems like a fairly simple deal if our union negotiates it properly...
Narrow body pay for trips flown on the 757.. Wide Body pay for trips flown on the 767.
Reserve pay would have to be negotiated..
At other carriers flying both the 757 and 767, reserve is paid at the higher rate..
...rate during vacation?
...rate during sick?
...rate in recurring sim training?
...rate while teaching in the sim?
We get paid for many things that don't actually involve flight time, and this is why the company prefers to pay "overrides" vs. agree to a separate/higher pay rate.
06-25-2011, 06:33 PM
#34
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Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: B767 FO
Posts: 423
I think what "Jumbo Pilot" and "Adlerdriver" are pointing out is that other PAX airlines have figured this issue out already, we, don't need to re-invent the wheel. The airplanes have been around since the early 1980s. Between ALPA and APA, I think we can find the best thing that works for us.
And, by the way, it is a 757/767 type, I don't see the Feds letting FedEx be the only operator in the world to do it differently.
And, by the way, it is a 757/767 type, I don't see the Feds letting FedEx be the only operator in the world to do it differently.
06-26-2011, 12:22 PM
#35
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Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: Gear Monkey
Posts: 3,199
I think what "Jumbo Pilot" and "Adlerdriver" are pointing out is that other PAX airlines have figured this issue out already, we, don't need to re-invent the wheel. The airplanes have been around since the early 1980s. Between ALPA and APA, I think we can find the best thing that works for us.
And, by the way, it is a 757/767 type, I don't see the Feds letting FedEx be the only operator in the world to do it differently.
And, by the way, it is a 757/767 type, I don't see the Feds letting FedEx be the only operator in the world to do it differently.
I don't believe any other airline pays the 757 at 737/727 rates.
That was clearly a concession in the Nov 2006 contract....and we may end up with 150 of them on property some day.
06-26-2011, 12:34 PM
#36
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Joined APC: Apr 2006
Position: MD-11 Captain
Posts: 4,304
Unfortunately, it looks like we reinvented the payscale for the 757 --- classifying it as straight, narrowbody pay.
I don't believe any other airline pays the 757 at 737/727 rates.
That was clearly a concession in the Nov 2006 contract....and we may end up with 150 of them on property some day.
I don't believe any other airline pays the 757 at 737/727 rates.
That was clearly a concession in the Nov 2006 contract....and we may end up with 150 of them on property some day.
Actually, I seem to recall it (757 = narrow body pay) being "negotiated" in exchange for really big "A380" payrates
. I'd say we got snookerd on that deal?
06-26-2011, 08:12 PM
#37
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Posts: 3,118
06-27-2011, 10:09 AM
#39
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: B767 FO
Posts: 423
Unfortunately, it looks like we reinvented the payscale for the 757 --- classifying it as straight, narrowbody pay.
I don't believe any other airline pays the 757 at 737/727 rates.
That was clearly a concession in the Nov 2006 contract....and we may end up with 150 of them on property some day.
I don't believe any other airline pays the 757 at 737/727 rates.
That was clearly a concession in the Nov 2006 contract....and we may end up with 150 of them on property some day.
CAL has Small Narrow Body, Large Narrow Body and Wide Body:
Small NB is the 737-300/500/700
Large NB is the 737-800/900 and the 757-200/300
Wide is the 767-200/400 and the 777-200
TWA had the DC-9-10/30/40/50, MD-80 and 727-200 all in one pay scale.
Some airlines split pay for each individual fleet, sometimes with a noticable difference in pay, sometimes it is a matter of a few dollars/hour. Look at Delta's current pay scales. In our case, we aren't that unique in how we do it, and one could argue that the Airbus guys get a bump in pay.
I don't really mind the NB/WB pay that we have. All I am saying is that many pilot groups have already gone down this road and figured it out. We don't need to totally reinvent the wheel regarding the pay issue should we get the 767.
As "MaydayMark" said, we traded 757 pay for A380. That's fine, like I said, thousands of ways to slice the pie. Bad deal, maybe, maybe not. Time will tell. In my opinion however, to call that a concession, is a poor choice of words and a little insulting. The Legacy PAX guys took concessions, so far, we haven't taken concessions.
06-27-2011, 10:17 AM
#40
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Joined APC: Mar 2009
Position: 757 Capt
Posts: 798
As "MaydayMark" said, we traded 757 pay for A380. That's fine, like I said, thousands of ways to slice the pie. Bad deal, maybe, maybe not. Time will tell. In my opinion however, to call that a concession, is a poor choice of words and a little insulting. The Legacy PAX guys took concessions, so far, we haven't taken concessions.
Every contract has been a concession.
Please try to at least put an eye on the ball momentarily.
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