FDX Poolies
09-05-2010, 08:46 AM
#121
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,068
It ain't about that at all. It's easy to sum it up if you're just talking about training pay. We're sitting here, and we're supposed to be a major airline, and we're talking about training pay. I mean listen, we're sitting here talking about training pay, not the line, not the line, not the line, but we're talking about training pay. Not the line that we go out there and die for and fly every trip as if it's our last but we're talking about training pay. How silly is that?
Now I know that we're supposed to lead by example and all that but I'm not shoving that aside like it don't mean anything. I know it's important, I honestly do but we're talking about training pay. We're talking about training pay man. We're talking about training pay. We're talking about training pay. We're not talking about the line. We're talking about training pay. When you come to the aoc, and you see me fly, you've seen me fly right, you've seen me give everything I've got, but we're talking about training pay right now.
Now I know that we're supposed to lead by example and all that but I'm not shoving that aside like it don't mean anything. I know it's important, I honestly do but we're talking about training pay. We're talking about training pay man. We're talking about training pay. We're talking about training pay. We're not talking about the line. We're talking about training pay. When you come to the aoc, and you see me fly, you've seen me fly right, you've seen me give everything I've got, but we're talking about training pay right now.
09-05-2010, 08:52 AM
#122
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: 767 FO
Posts: 8,047
Fdxlag,
The training pay is low, but the first year pay isn't bad. I doubt we will have a shortage of applicants. If I were on the streets or working a regional, I'd be all over HKG if that was what I was offered.
If I didn't have a savings, I'd live off credit cards if I needed too. I'm sure there would be some crashpads in HKG that wouldn't break the bank. If you ever commuted to New York, you would see similar situations. Way too many guys in a cramped apartment. After one year (the first three months would probably be in Memphis), they would be making pretty good money (139/hour). Not too bad.....
The training pay is low, but the first year pay isn't bad. I doubt we will have a shortage of applicants. If I were on the streets or working a regional, I'd be all over HKG if that was what I was offered.
If I didn't have a savings, I'd live off credit cards if I needed too. I'm sure there would be some crashpads in HKG that wouldn't break the bank. If you ever commuted to New York, you would see similar situations. Way too many guys in a cramped apartment. After one year (the first three months would probably be in Memphis), they would be making pretty good money (139/hour). Not too bad.....
Ten years ago my 1st year paychecks were about 1200 every 15 days or so. I learned real quick that if I used my extra 6 hours a month open time capability or if I put myself on volunteer status while waiting around for my jumpseat home I could bump my paycheck up by 20-25%. At the 6 month point or so I learned the most important FDX crewdog lesson; C/O make life a whole lot easier.
Now I know that some people will always fly extra, but one of our goals at ALPA ought to be to lessen the need to fly extra.
09-05-2010, 08:53 AM
#123
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: 767 FO
Posts: 8,047
It ain't about that at all. It's easy to sum it up if you're just talking about training pay. We're sitting here, and we're supposed to be a major airline, and we're talking about training pay. I mean listen, we're sitting here talking about training pay, not the line, not the line, not the line, but we're talking about training pay. Not the line that we go out there and die for and fly every trip as if it's our last but we're talking about training pay. How silly is that?
Now I know that we're supposed to lead by example and all that but I'm not shoving that aside like it don't mean anything. I know it's important, I honestly do but we're talking about training pay. We're talking about training pay man. We're talking about training pay. We're talking about training pay. We're not talking about the line. We're talking about training pay. When you come to the aoc, and you see me fly, you've seen me fly right, you've seen me give everything I've got, but we're talking about training pay right now.
Now I know that we're supposed to lead by example and all that but I'm not shoving that aside like it don't mean anything. I know it's important, I honestly do but we're talking about training pay. We're talking about training pay man. We're talking about training pay. We're talking about training pay. We're not talking about the line. We're talking about training pay. When you come to the aoc, and you see me fly, you've seen me fly right, you've seen me give everything I've got, but we're talking about training pay right now.
PS You and DLAX are talking about training pay. I am talking about new hire pay which to me covers the whole 1st year.
Last edited by FDXLAG; 09-05-2010 at 02:26 PM.
09-05-2010, 08:55 AM
#124
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: 767 FO
Posts: 8,047
No wonder so many people think pilots are spoiled prima-donnas. Yes, $2000 a month in training may be a little rough. That's more than many Americans make. After training, the minimum you can make is 59.39/hr at 17 hours a week guaranteed. So worst case...first year you make $45,375. Per capita income (2000 census) was $21,587. In other words you will make more than double the amount average Americans make. And that is only for 1 short year. Second year minimum pay is $67,343,12 not including per diem. That is 17 hours a week at 59.39 (727 2nd officer.) No one makes that unless they don't want to work...reap what you sow. Some of my fellow aviators truly embarrass me. You have the same sense of entitlement as the welfare dregs that we all detest. If you don't like the pay scale, start your own business; become a professional athlete; become an actor...just stop whining like little high school *****e$ that want the latest iGadget because you DESERVE it!
As I keep trying to say it aint about the money it is about training pilots to live off of BLG. I think that will improve QOL for all of us.
09-05-2010, 08:56 AM
#125
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Position: ANC -11 FO
Posts: 189
[QUOTE=TheBaron;866292]No wonder so many people think pilots are spoiled . So worst case...first year you make $45,375. Per capita income (2000 census) was $21,587.
Not to nit pick your point, but a quick Google search showed 2008 US median income to be $52,029. Just sayin' . . .
Not to nit pick your point, but a quick Google search showed 2008 US median income to be $52,029. Just sayin' . . .
09-05-2010, 09:59 AM
#126
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: MD-11 FO
Posts: 608
[quote=2005 Blues;866304]
Like I said, 2000 census (the last one with completed data) was 21,857. 2008 numbers are an estimate. 2010 numbers are not released yet. http://2010.census.gov/2010census
My point is, if you are wanting to play this game, know what you are getting into, plan accordingly, and realize you are a cog in the machine. If you want more out of a career start your own business. As much as we (pilots) like to boast about our unique and valuable abilities, we aren't any more critical than the guy that loads, fuels, or maintains the plane.
My point is, if you are wanting to play this game, know what you are getting into, plan accordingly, and realize you are a cog in the machine. If you want more out of a career start your own business. As much as we (pilots) like to boast about our unique and valuable abilities, we aren't any more critical than the guy that loads, fuels, or maintains the plane.
09-05-2010, 10:05 AM
#127
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: MD-11 FO
Posts: 608
And before everyone freaks out... yes, our skill set is a more unique compared to the majority of employees and we command a handsome bonus because of it. That doesn't mean we are the any more critical to the operation.
09-05-2010, 10:14 AM
#128
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: 767 FO
Posts: 8,047
Like I said, 2000 census (the last one with completed data) was 21,857. 2008 numbers are an estimate. 2010 numbers are not released yet. 2010 Census
My point is, if you are wanting to play this game, know what you are getting into, plan accordingly, and realize you are a cog in the machine. If you want more out of a career start your own business. As much as we (pilots) like to boast about our unique and valuable abilities, we aren't any more critical than the guy that loads, fuels, or maintains the plane.
Just curious, when you say per capita do you mean per capita?
What does your site say about household income?
Last edited by FDXLAG; 09-05-2010 at 10:43 AM. Reason: fix quote
09-05-2010, 10:18 AM
#129
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: MD-11 FO
Posts: 608
My post wasn't in response to anything you said in particular, just the "flavor" of the thread in general. Sure, let's try to raise 1st year pay along with pay for everyone else. If some "great people" don't want to work here because they find 1st year pay insulting, their loss. Where do people get the impression that some group (potential new hires) is "owed" something before they have done the work necessary to "earn" it.
09-05-2010, 10:20 AM
#130
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: MD-11 FO
Posts: 608
[quote=FDXLAG;866333]
Yes, I mean per capita. Household income implies all wage earners living at the same reporting address. Family income is a measurement of all income earned by family members living at the same reporting address. Big difference. If your household/family income isn't sufficient, tell your spouse to get a higher paying job. Maybe your suggesting that pilots with spouses that don't work outside the home should receive greater compensation?
Last edited by TheBaron; 09-05-2010 at 10:33 AM.
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