IPA: "We are a union, not a social club"
05-01-2010, 09:35 AM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: 767 Captain
Posts: 3,989
First thing - awesome letter.
Possible stupid question alert......... actually 2 questions:
1- With such direct, no-nonsense language basically telling the membership not to JA or pick up open time, how is this not going to become a "status quo" issue legally? (in light of recent rulings against "job actions" by other airline unions).
2- If this actually isn't a problem, the why the heck have we not seen a similar letter from the Fedex ALPA leadership?
Possible stupid question alert......... actually 2 questions:
1- With such direct, no-nonsense language basically telling the membership not to JA or pick up open time, how is this not going to become a "status quo" issue legally? (in light of recent rulings against "job actions" by other airline unions).
2- If this actually isn't a problem, the why the heck have we not seen a similar letter from the Fedex ALPA leadership?
05-01-2010, 09:37 AM
#22
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: The IPA EB speaks for me
Posts: 529
Did anyone see anything after 767Pilot's post before Adlerdriver's? I know I DID NOT.
Adler, both are in the IPA/UPS 2006 contract.
Adler, both are in the IPA/UPS 2006 contract.
Last edited by MoosePileit; 05-01-2010 at 09:41 AM. Reason: something smells rotten, though
05-01-2010, 09:45 AM
#23
Tri-tanic operator
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Position: Doggie
Posts: 2,382
Those figures look great. But figures lie and liars figure ... 
Seriously Bob, in spite of the numbers, something doesn't add up.
I have been at Brown a little over 3 years. Lets say 22 bid periods. I have been on RSV for at least 15-16 bid periods at 2 different bases.
My experience as a RSV has been the following:
1) They never have, and probably never will, have adequate staffing during the transitions.
2) When they have ample RSV coverage, there tend to be few trips open.
3) When RSV coverage is at its lowest, there tends to be the most trips in open time.
This is only my observations at 2 bases in 3 years.
But even the numbers you highlighted don't support what is happening in the system. I have seen 3 managers just in PVG alone on the same day, all doing MEF. So much for the law of averages ...
Seriously Bob, in spite of the numbers, something doesn't add up.
I have been at Brown a little over 3 years. Lets say 22 bid periods. I have been on RSV for at least 15-16 bid periods at 2 different bases.
My experience as a RSV has been the following:
1) They never have, and probably never will, have adequate staffing during the transitions.
2) When they have ample RSV coverage, there tend to be few trips open.
3) When RSV coverage is at its lowest, there tends to be the most trips in open time.
This is only my observations at 2 bases in 3 years.
But even the numbers you highlighted don't support what is happening in the system. I have seen 3 managers just in PVG alone on the same day, all doing MEF. So much for the law of averages ...
05-01-2010, 09:46 AM
#24
Tri-tanic operator
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Position: Doggie
Posts: 2,382
Since you asked, I thought I'd do some simple addition to make sense out of the OT and JA numbers.
Last year IPA crewmembers picked up more than 88,000 hours of Open Time and accepted more than 7,000 hours of JA...
How does that relate to daily flying? Broken down into something easier to relate to, 88,000 credit hours per year = about 241 credit hours per day = 40 pilots flying OT per day.
If those hours were not picked up, how would this affect the reserves? I chose 5 May as an average day and looked at the RADAR lists. I totaled the number of reserves scheduled.
The total number of reserves scheduled on May 5 is 390. Of course, quite a few are not available due to vacation, training, military, breaks, sick, etc. I don't know what that number will be, but if we assume about 25% of the scheduled reserves are not available, then that leaves about 300 to cover those 40 OT trips in addition to whatever reserve callouts may become necessary.
Similarly, 7,000 credit hours of JA per year = 19 credit hours per day = 3 pilots per day on average. If all of those go to MEF, that would require, on average, 3 managers per day.
YMMV.
Last year IPA crewmembers picked up more than 88,000 hours of Open Time and accepted more than 7,000 hours of JA...
How does that relate to daily flying? Broken down into something easier to relate to, 88,000 credit hours per year = about 241 credit hours per day = 40 pilots flying OT per day.
If those hours were not picked up, how would this affect the reserves? I chose 5 May as an average day and looked at the RADAR lists. I totaled the number of reserves scheduled.
The total number of reserves scheduled on May 5 is 390. Of course, quite a few are not available due to vacation, training, military, breaks, sick, etc. I don't know what that number will be, but if we assume about 25% of the scheduled reserves are not available, then that leaves about 300 to cover those 40 OT trips in addition to whatever reserve callouts may become necessary.
Similarly, 7,000 credit hours of JA per year = 19 credit hours per day = 3 pilots per day on average. If all of those go to MEF, that would require, on average, 3 managers per day.
YMMV.
05-01-2010, 09:57 AM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: Brown ones
Posts: 216
05-01-2010, 10:01 AM
#26
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Position: 757/767
Posts: 579
I agree. Averages do not account for peaks and valleys.
If anyone wants to check my 390 reserves-scheduled number (while 5 May is still on the RADAR lists), this is how it broke down.
Fleet/Captain/First Officer
757 24 32
SDFZ 16 30
ONT 20 29
MIA 15 14
A3OO 29 28
MD11 SDF 34 36
MD11 ANC 11 32
747 14 26
Totals 163 227
If anyone wants to check my 390 reserves-scheduled number (while 5 May is still on the RADAR lists), this is how it broke down.
Fleet/Captain/First Officer
757 24 32
SDFZ 16 30
ONT 20 29
MIA 15 14
A3OO 29 28
MD11 SDF 34 36
MD11 ANC 11 32
747 14 26
Totals 163 227
05-01-2010, 10:31 AM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: The IPA EB speaks for me
Posts: 529
Non-IPA Folks, thank you for the support!
IPA Guys- Pullleaaze, STOP FEEDING THE TROLL!
There is a great line in the original "DUSK TIL DAWN". Harvey Keitel's character asks George Clooney's character, in a cleaned up paraphrase:
Are YOU SUCH A Loser that you don't know when you've won?
The dump and burn avatar is PERFECT. How fast can I burn through mine so I can go get yours?!
IPA Guys- Pullleaaze, STOP FEEDING THE TROLL!
There is a great line in the original "DUSK TIL DAWN". Harvey Keitel's character asks George Clooney's character, in a cleaned up paraphrase:
Are YOU SUCH A Loser that you don't know when you've won?
The dump and burn avatar is PERFECT. How fast can I burn through mine so I can go get yours?!
05-01-2010, 10:34 AM
#28
Tri-tanic operator
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Position: Doggie
Posts: 2,382
I agree. Averages do not account for peaks and valleys.
If anyone wants to check my 390 reserves-scheduled number (while 5 May is still on the RADAR lists), this is how it broke down.
The total number of reserves scheduled on May 5 is 390. Of course, quite a few are not available due to vacation, training, military, breaks, sick, etc. I don't know what that number will be, but if we assume about 25% of the scheduled reserves are not available, then that leaves about 300 to cover those 40 OT trips in addition to whatever reserve callouts may become necessary
If anyone wants to check my 390 reserves-scheduled number (while 5 May is still on the RADAR lists), this is how it broke down.
The total number of reserves scheduled on May 5 is 390. Of course, quite a few are not available due to vacation, training, military, breaks, sick, etc. I don't know what that number will be, but if we assume about 25% of the scheduled reserves are not available, then that leaves about 300 to cover those 40 OT trips in addition to whatever reserve callouts may become necessary
Probably more like 80% are unavailable in some way or another. There's the OBVIOUS that you pointed out ... VAC, BRK, SIK, TNG, etc
But your numbers insinuate that these RSVs are available 24/7 for unlimited contact and flying. But how many RSV are actually available for those 40 open trips ...
In the appropriate seat ? fleet ? and base ?
With the appropriate number of days available ?
At the appropriate call-in period ?
With enough duty hours remaining ?
All of these variables tend to lower the "available" number of RSVs at any given time.
At a glance on paper, it looks like 390 RSVs would be plenty for 40 trips. In reality, the numbers aren't as cut and dry as you would like to think.
Those managers weren't in PVG on MEF covering a peak or valley. Just regular old bid package trips that couldn't be covered with the available RSVs.
Which is EXACTLY why the JA/OT ban is having an effect on the system and why 100% participation in this ban is important. In spite of your beliefs ...
Last edited by CactusCrew; 05-01-2010 at 10:47 AM.
05-01-2010, 10:36 AM
#29
Tri-tanic operator
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Position: Doggie
Posts: 2,382
05-01-2010, 10:56 AM
#30
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2005
Position: 767 captain
Posts: 2,701
First thing - awesome letter.
Possible stupid question alert......... actually 2 questions:
1- With such direct, no-nonsense language basically telling the membership not to JA or pick up open time, how is this not going to become a "status quo" issue legally? (in light of recent rulings against "job actions" by other airline unions
Possible stupid question alert......... actually 2 questions:
1- With such direct, no-nonsense language basically telling the membership not to JA or pick up open time, how is this not going to become a "status quo" issue legally? (in light of recent rulings against "job actions" by other airline unions
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