Freightpuppy

Actually I liked Dr. Kevorkian. If someone wants to die, they should be able to, not forced to live in pain and suffering because some bible thumper a-hole thinks they should.

Freightpuppy

Amen to that bro! The execs have figured out the system and know there really are no consequences to robbing a company blind and hosing everyone in their wake. This behavior will continue in the name of greed until there are consequences.

FliFast

Why quit, we'll be furloughed first.

The point of the original author's posting was, UPS has approached the pilot group for concessions because they are trying to sell that the company needs to belt tighten because the recovery is not taking hold as quickly as possible. Since they were unsuccessful in obtaining contractual (vis-a-vis voluntary which they did have for 8 to 10 months and decided it wasn't enough) they are now punishing the pilot group with layoffs.

Inadvertently, the scheduling/staffing of the airline is being stressed and the first pilots have not been let go, nor has the mass re-training of the airline started.

Unfortunately, analysts beg to differ thus making it harder for UPS to sell us on the need for belt tightening.


FF

FliFast

Jungle,

In a departure from the norm, I actually disagree with your post. Allow me to throw my two cents in, maybe I just plain misunderstood you.

Making a profit at UPS does not necessarily ensure job security for pilots. The airline is not the core business, and the company is experimenting with other facets of their business plan to reach and maintain profitablity. I emphasize this point by citing that as FedEx announces new air products we have not matched them.

Secondly, I don't agree that furloughs are a small tribulation. At UPS Airline there has never been a furlough since it's inception. For many lucky individuals, UPS is their first airline and have never been furloughed elsewhere. For those who have been on unemployment insurance/food stamps, yes it is a large tribulation with life changing after-effects.

Lastly, I don't content that UPS is "cooking their books". However, with the limited expereince I have in Business Administration/Accounting companies can use Generally Accepted Accounting Practices to reflect a half-full or half-empty portrait of their operation. As a counter-argument, showing a profit (or a "loss" as more commonly reflected in the airline industry) does not always reflect a true picture of a company's health, but however; a reflection of what the Board of Directors would like the shareholders, labor, and the investment community to think.

Just my two cents, Jungle.

Best Regards,
FF

767pilot

Is that true that nobody has started training yet? I was trying to think of the possibility of this madness just being canceled. The system is just not working and it is costing them in terms of reliability, timeliness, and flexibility. There are magazines in various places around the system that haven't been straightened in weeks.

The problem is that they have turned down 90 million dollars from us that they could have had, and want to use the RIFF language for the last bid. The Riff is said to save them about 2/3rds of what the costs would be of running a regular displacement bid for the 8.

The company would need cover for their ego and that could come from "new charter opportunities" or the ever popular "unexpected economic growth and recovery" or some such MBA BS. The 90 million probably would never have been realized anyhow as it could have been canceled when business got better, and it will almost certainly do that before the 3 years would have been up.

That leaves the RIFF. That they would just to have to eat as the cost of getting their system back under control. The savings that they think that they are getting will prove elusive anyhow, as future bids will be taken by people seeking to return to their previous domiciles or equipment, clogging up the training center and causing recurring ripples for years to come.

That said, I'm afraid the news will be bad for the first round of guys. I'm not sure that the corporate ego will allow them to back track at this point. Beyond that though, I just don't see how this thing can run as long or as deep as was threatened.

My two cents, worth exactly what you paid for it.
Discuss amongst yourselves...

SaltyDog

On a positive note. Blending the two comments of FF and Jungle, the IPA has discussed at length the profitability of some flying contracts that provide a very good rate of return which is beneficial to the shareholder. The ancillary fallout: UPS will need more pilots, mechanics, etc to capture this profit. The March announcement of the latest business award is indicative that management may indeed want a cut at this profit center using UPS resources. Certainly the direction we all (shareholder and employee) would like our management team to enhance.

Roberto

Why do you say that? There were 144 training events in the last training award. The total in classes already started or starting in April alone is 67. I read UPS is using additional contract sim instructors, and besides doing sims in SDF and ANC has sims scheduled in MEM and DEN. There were 210 training events in the previous 2 training awards, which are either finished or finishing up soon.

FliFast

767,

From the long term training message, training started Apr 1st. Correct me if I'm wrong, I believe the last classes will be in August.

As we progress down this road, class will start to overlap classes, simulators may go down for MX., reserve crewmembers on the line will be tasked with flying the extra flights. Crew members will need days off to move to Anchorage.

All of which will further stress the staffing of the airline.

IMHO, it will be a rocky Spring/Summer.

FF

767pilot

That would be their cover should they decide to back out of this

SaltyDog

Unfortunately, as posted , UPA management (Labor folks) need the face saving of the furlough. Can't shoot the IPA twice with furlough notices and call both off at the last minute. However, agree that depth and length of the numbers and time on furlough is highly suspect using company projections. There is some business justification (especially with Worldport efficiences about to be realized shortly in extra sort capacity, etc) but the business reasons are mostly diminished with the improving volumes.