cactusmike

Here at Cactus West we have the option on our final weight and balance to use 5 or 15 for t/o: I usually use 15 because of the lower v speeds. Most captains use 15, we are usually at 240k or greater for t/o. landings are 30, 25 on a rare occasion for gusty winds, 20 for single engine work and some other malfunctions.

Landings are much better at heavy weights, the CAL guy that talked about landing above Vref hit it on the head, a little speed makes a better landing and it won't float if you keep it fairly flat (good xwind technique as well). I use autobrakes 2 almost always.

I have saved a couple of guys from the pitch up on landing deal with the spoilers popping up. If you have an aft cg and the guy held it off you are vulnerable. Guard the yoke and be ready if the other guy doesn't catch it. I just put my hand on the column to give it a little push forward - usually you have to fly the nose down but sometimes.......!

To the FedEx instructor....every v1 cut I have ever done was a rudder first maneuver. Don't give it the boot and the 757 will eat your a##. Go to 15 units right away and back off from there when you dial in the rudder trim. Cool thing about the 75 is the rudder trim matches the fuel flow on the good engine.

We do a lot of SNA noisa abatement T/Os at AWA (oops, USAirways). You need to rotate normally until you are at 15 degrees, fly it off and then, above 50 to 100 feet you can honk it up to 25 degrees. That is with flaps 20 at max thrust, then at 1500' you cut back to about 1.42 EPR (Rollers on the wings). Still climbs like crazy and keeps the neighbors happy.

I have been displaced from holding a line on the 757 (3 lease returns in the last 6 months) and I am going back on the Airbus for a while. I will miss the 757, it has been my most favorite aircraft in the 21k hours I have flown.

MeXC

"we are usually at 240k or greater for t/o."

Wow. That's smokin' fast.

Blackbeard

First, my apologies on presentation. Apparently, I don't know how to multi-quote.

AV8R,

Your defensive posturing is understood. And I agree that we should be careful about painting with a broad brush. But, the ugly truth is that the overall MD11 school house does not enjoy a good reputation. I know this may surprise a lot of flex instructors to the point that it is outright dismissed (a problem in and of itself).

<<Wrong. There are no 'invitations' to join the training department, unless you call a posting, an application, recommendations, an interview and giving a presentation during the interview an 'invitation'.>>

Well....there are indeed invitations to apply. I know. I received several with encouragement.

<<Wrong. With several hundred Flex Instructors and only five track managers, I don't think there's a lot of daisy chain climbing room.>>

Well.... Actually, that place is a political vortex. Seems stroking for command is an underlying mission. By the way, how long have you been an instructor there? And, does anyone know the average tenure of the MD11 flex guys and gals?

<<I would love to borrow that extremely large brush you're using here to paint my house. Should be able to get the job done in only a couple of passes. I know all Flex Instructors would be ecstatic to have the CBA force the company to let us go to the line every other month, but it doesn't read that way.>>

I agree.... The CBA lacks incentive to go fly the line.

<<I haven't found a sim yet that isn't more squirrely than the aircraft it emulates. If you are trained well enough to pass a checkride in something harder to fly, you should then be able to fly the aircraft. Also, you're blurring the lines of responsibility between Flex Instructors and LCAs. We teach you procedures and emergency responses, LCAs are there to teach you how to fly the real airplane.>>

1) Squirrelly sims --- agree!
2) LCA duties vs. Flex duites --- HOLD ON! Here may be a very fundamental and serious issue. We must take a more serious approach to stick and rudder skills in the school house. The line between a flex and an LCA SHOULD be blurred!

<<Hang on, I'm writing this down: "A V1 cut is a rudder maneuver..." Any more gems like that would be great and I'm sure we'd love to incorporate them in our training curriculum.>>

But it is a rudder-first maneuver.

<<The job of a Flex Instructor is to teach you proficiency in procedures and maneuvers delineated by 121 App E or the applicable AQP syllabus. We will teach you to the best of our abilities to 'fly', but it's just the sim. The real 'flying' instruction is on the line. Again the confusion between Flex and LCA. Also, that rather enormous chip on your shoulder against military guys is showing just a teensy-weensy bit...>>

Sorry.... "...but it's just a sim" doesn't cut it. I seriously hope we are not uncovering what may be a raw component of what's going on. By the way, I have a military background.

I hesitate to post this "dirty laundry." But I believe there are bigger issues here and if posting stuff like this gets some attention, then so be it.

highflyer

[QUOTE=PastV1;606140]Guess you never fly the 727-200- 2S2F Sim! It ib n no way simulated the actual aircraft.

I agree. and in no way does the MD-11 sim compare to the real airplane when it comes to crosswind landings. You fly the real airplane to the runway, in the sim you plug in the aileron and if you take it out you're screwed. I can play the game like anyone else, but the sim just can't teach you a realistic crosswind landing.

Lucky7

I believe AV8 was referring to the a "rudder only" maneuver yeah right was claiming. Yeah referenced a scolding received if you were using the yoke at all. Reminded me of my "old airline" who had a rudder maneuver used to deal with wake turbulence until it didn't work and things broke. If I had a buck every time somebody told me how it should be done I wouldn't need a 2 am wakeup call again.

av8rmike

You miss the point. Although someone might have told you "You should apply", that doesn't change the process in place or the requirements to become a Flex. Additionally, you weren't told you should apply based on your 'excellence in your previous life' as he said. You were told you should apply based on your performance in training or on the line.


I've been in two school houses here and aside from just a few people, noone wants the top jobs. Since I've been here and seen that, your comment about everyone 'stroking for command' is way off base. What does it matter how long I've been an instructor? Long enough. How long have you been bidding B Res or Tulsa O&Bs? As long as the Association takes care of us via the CBA, we'll have plenty of opportunity to go fly... Ooops.


We do teach 'flying' basics and aircraft specifics as best we can within the limitations of a simulator. Regardless, you really learn to fly in the AIRPLANE with an LCA, NOT in the sim with a Flex. Apparently even the FAA recognizes this, ergo the requirements for IOE and consolidation.

That, my friend, was sarcasm. You think we don't teach that already? Or controlled rotation rates or crosswind techniques or a host of other items?


Again, you can take guys to the boat in the sim a thousand times, but that don't mean they're getting aboard the real thing at night. The instruction in the sim is no less intense just because it's a sim, but it just ain't the same...

FLMD11CAPT

[quote=av8rmike;606230]You miss the point. Although someone might have told you "You should apply", that doesn't change the process in place or the requirements to become a Flex. Additionally, you weren't told you should apply based on your 'excellence in your previous life' as he said. You were told you should apply based on your performance in training or on the line.

Hmmmm.......I wonder then, why is the "peer review" a definitive thumbs up/down criteria for hiring a flex.............remember, "absolute power corrupts absolutely"

av8rmike

You obviously know something the rest of us don't. Some managers request inputs, good or bad, on applicants while others don't. Never seen that to be 'definitive', though. That being said, if a number of instructors came in and said "Over my dead body do you hire that dirtball", I think that would carry some weight. As it should... I'm going to revel now in my absolute power and do the dishes because my wife just threatened me.

Deuce130

av8rmike - Your points are pretty good. In fact, you're pretty much owning the board right now. Those complaining about the training dept sound like they're grinding axes. If someone doesn't like how training here at FDX is done, then I'd recommend becoming a FLEX/LCA or scheduling a meeting with the head of training to talk about it (let me know how that goes, though).

In my personal experience on the -27 and the Bus, the program has been pretty good. I also think I was pretty much super awesome in my previous life and I've never been invited to instruct! What gives????

FedElta

Ah Deuce, young grasshopper....if you had sprung for a tall frosty, I'm sure an invite would have been forthcoming...