757 Winglets
07-05-2008, 06:28 PM
#1
Slainge Var'
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Zeppelin Tail Gunner
Posts: 1,530
757 Winglets
Seems like pretty mundane stuff and unlikely to start a rousing written rumble but I have a question. Seems like every time I taxi past the 757 parked on the ramp, the F/O say's "I wonder why we didn't get those winglets like everybody else is getting on their 757s"? I can't think of a reason. They save fuel right? So...why didn't we?
Oops...this is about FedEx but I guess UPS had wingletless 757s too.
Oops...this is about FedEx but I guess UPS had wingletless 757s too.
07-05-2008, 06:42 PM
#2
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2007
Posts: 148
I had heard that the reason we aren't getting the winglets is because of the wingspan/footprint. We have limited space in MEM and the winglets would add an addtional 10-11 feet.
A 727 is what, around 108'? A 757 is 124' and a 757 with winglets is 135'.
I'm sure that decision was made last year when oil was around $50. With it near $150, I'm thinking we will see them shortly?
A 727 is what, around 108'? A 757 is 124' and a 757 with winglets is 135'.
I'm sure that decision was made last year when oil was around $50. With it near $150, I'm thinking we will see them shortly?
07-05-2008, 06:47 PM
#3
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Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: Curator at Static Display
Posts: 5,681
Cost-Effectiveness?
Pehaps it is Price vs benefit.
At UAL, they told us the maintenace cost on the 747-400's winglets almost negated the fuel savings...and this was in 2000/2001.
What maintenance costs? Well, there are a lot of bending loads on these things, and they tended to cause cracks in the structure at the wingtip. They spent a lot of time and money fixing them--sometimes planes were out of service as a result. THAT'S expensive.
Most STC mods I have ever heard of are hideously expensive. I'm sure the winglets are in the multi-million dollar category for a 757. You'd have to save a lot of fuel to justify them (and they only save about 1.5-2.0%, according to reports I have read).
At UAL, they told us the maintenace cost on the 747-400's winglets almost negated the fuel savings...and this was in 2000/2001.
What maintenance costs? Well, there are a lot of bending loads on these things, and they tended to cause cracks in the structure at the wingtip. They spent a lot of time and money fixing them--sometimes planes were out of service as a result. THAT'S expensive.
Most STC mods I have ever heard of are hideously expensive. I'm sure the winglets are in the multi-million dollar category for a 757. You'd have to save a lot of fuel to justify them (and they only save about 1.5-2.0%, according to reports I have read).
07-05-2008, 07:28 PM
#4
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2006
Posts: 1,000
They told us during recurrent that the winglets on the 757 aren't as effective at higher speeds, ie our next-day inbound/outbounds. The pax carriers typically operate at the Cost Index 40 range as do we at times, but they won't usually operate at the higher range. We (UPS) typically operate at CI555 during our west coast departures and elsewhere.
07-05-2008, 08:06 PM
#6
Looking for a laugh
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Posts: 4,099
07-05-2008, 08:15 PM
#7
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Posts: 157
Flight time
At the "majors", a 757 flies maybe 14 hours a day. Here at U, our 757's fly maybe 6 or 8 hours a day. 2% fuel savings on a 757 doing 4 trans-cons a day may pay for the modification in a few years. 2% fuel savings on a 757 flying RFD-DTW twice a day won't even pay for the mod.
Rott
Rott
07-05-2008, 09:03 PM
#8
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Joined APC: Jul 2006
Position: Boeing Hearing and Ergonomics Lab Rat, Night Shift
Posts: 1,724
Cost Index 40, LOL
More like single digit...
I'm thinking it's less the speed and more howm much time the plane spends in the air every day. I'd venture to guess the pax aircraft spend much more time in the air so the amortization time is much less than in the freight world.
That's also why the economically unviable pax aircraft can still be converted to freighters and be profitable...
Cheers
George
Last edited by georgetg; 07-05-2008 at 09:03 PM. Reason: speeliiing
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