⌐ AV8OR WANNABE

For us newbies, what do you mean by rough treatment? - Their work schedules, domicile changes or something else? I heard that their schedules change frequently but I figured considering they get captain pay from day one (I think?) maybe it’s understandable the company wants to keep them flying as much as possible? Again, I know very little about their working conditions; so how much different is an average day at work for a mgmt. pilot when compared to a line guy/gal?

SaltyDog

Simply, they can treat them as rude as us on scheduling. The whole existence for many of them is simply an everpresent 24 hour RSV period regardless of the 'day job'. A line pilot has a contract and we have certain protections contained within, a recourse if we have been improperly treated . It is not perfect, the company violates the contract routinely, etc. But we have a process and don't worry about where we stand w/r/t pay or seniority. In other words, a quality of life that is predictable and without significant concern. We bid whatever seniority we can hold that fits the lifestyle we choose. They don't always have that option. Go to ANC when they want you to, live in SDF if you work here. Commutes happen for them, but not with a routine we enjoy. They are bound only by FAR's and I have seen them used to FAR's , etc. Most of them chose this career path (not all had a real choice) and thus don't feel 'sorry' but, like the military, they are 24/7 owned by UPS and I am not. Watching UPS exercise their ownership rights can be amazing. They have been put in dilemmas. I.e. teach an AQP all day, told they will fly 8 hours later,etc. The supervisors when sent out and have no real guarantee when they will return. At least when we schedule an event and , in the rare circumstance, we don't get home in time, we usually have a nice pay compensation. They serve the same corporate behemoth with no real protection.

Rocco

Salty

What did you mean by not all had a real choice?

767pilot

Some were only offered a job at UPS as a manager. There are about 3000 of us that wouldn't touch those jobs with a ten foot pole (we are all offered the chance each january), so they have to hire off of the street.

SaltyDog

Most did, some at the beginning were offered "management" jobs. if you said "no" then you had no job. I worked with some of those guys in the Training center. They used to inquire what the line pilot who went "management" was thinking. Those were some of the folks who wanted to be a line pilot but needed a job. Then, during the furloughs in the early 90's and after 9/11, folks came over from the legacies. Sound familiar? Some were offered 'management' jobs, not a line pilot job. Again, no option. Not the majority, most made their own bed. Like 767Pilot said, they offer all of us an opportunity to 'be promoted" It is interesting to see an new supervisor as a new hire and then see them after being here a few years, some have very different experiences and attitudes. I like the line like 99.9% of us. I think most of our friends on the supervisory would as well, especially if fences are put into place to protect their earnings capabilities and your seniority.

Rocco

Thanks Salty! Interesting.

Rocco

You mean they offer all line pilots "management jobs" every year?

767pilot

we get a form letter inviting us to explore the wonders of the dark side <G>. Very few even consider it.

⌐ AV8OR WANNABE

Everything you said made sense to me except the comparison above. I see where you're coming from but do not forget that a new hire mngr makes at least $100,000/year more (maybe $150,000? - I don't know the actual numbers) than a new hire line pilot during the first year (with stock options it’s probably even more). We might be getting a nice pay compensation if we get home a day or so later but surely it isn't an extra 100K/year, is it?

1800 RVR

Not all FQSO start at CA payrates. Those hired as FEs are paid FE pay, while those hired as CA's will get CA pay. Every FQSO is paid differently.