Nasty new UPS rumor
06-05-2007, 08:52 PM
#61
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: MD-11/10 Captain
Posts: 533
Rangers lead the way!
06-06-2007, 11:40 AM
#62
Slainge Var'
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Zeppelin Tail Gunner
Posts: 1,530
Virtually all UPS new hires are going into F/O seats in big airplanes flying some of the most trying equipment (MD’s) into some of the world’s lousiest airports. Yes, Clark in the Philippines night/IMC/no radar in a big airplane is different that Akron in an RJ.
1930s...Pan Am Clippers, HNL to Shanghai
1940s...C-47s crossing the hump
1950s...DC-4s and 6s crossing the Pacific
2000s..MD-11s with dual IRS's, GNS, dual VHF/HF, CPDLC and ADS, dual autopilots and autothrottles, an augmented crew with a sleep facility (for us just sometimes).........and this is a challenge? I'd say it's fair to say there are the bones of some old pilots spinning in the grave over that. On the other hand, they all might be at happy hour in heaven laughing their asses off.
1930s...Pan Am Clippers, HNL to Shanghai
1940s...C-47s crossing the hump
1950s...DC-4s and 6s crossing the Pacific
2000s..MD-11s with dual IRS's, GNS, dual VHF/HF, CPDLC and ADS, dual autopilots and autothrottles, an augmented crew with a sleep facility (for us just sometimes).........and this is a challenge? I'd say it's fair to say there are the bones of some old pilots spinning in the grave over that. On the other hand, they all might be at happy hour in heaven laughing their asses off.
06-06-2007, 12:56 PM
#63
Gets all holidays off
Joined APC: Feb 2005
Position: Retired UPS 767 Captain, SDF Z
Posts: 431
Personally, I don't think that flying the -8 is that demanding. As you said in your post, and I totally agree, every a/c has its own "gotchas" if you aren't paying attention: pod strikes and tail strikes are 2 biggies. As long as you are thinking about them, you lessen your chance of an incident.
Complacency - it can even happen in the semi-"automated" -8!
Complacency - it can even happen in the semi-"automated" -8!
06-06-2007, 09:44 PM
#64
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: Leftof longitudinal
Posts: 1,899
Personally, I don't think that flying the -8 is that demanding. As you said in your post, and I totally agree, every a/c has its own "gotchas" if you aren't paying attention: pod strikes and tail strikes are 2 biggies. As long as you are thinking about them, you lessen your chance of an incident.
Complacency - it can even happen in the semi-"automated" -8!
Complacency - it can even happen in the semi-"automated" -8!
danger!"
Last edited by SaltyDog; 06-06-2007 at 09:53 PM.
06-07-2007, 06:27 AM
#65
New ride...
Joined APC: Apr 2005
Posts: 534
Cripes 1800, that is all I use to scare guys off and not transition! All these 727 guys just bumped me down and I am peddling "danger 8's" are no place for anyone used to Boeings, glass etc. The SDF MD guys are next. Help yourself out and me too . "The 8 is dangerous, the 8 is
danger!"
danger!"
Doh!!
I can be very dense sometimes. Then again, I also took a whackin' on the FO side. I tried back when the displacement bid was open, however, I failed bigtime. But, you are absolutely correct:THE -8 IS A DEATHTRAP! STAY FAR, FAR AWAY!!!!!
P.S. Sorry to spoil the "plan."
06-07-2007, 08:34 AM
#66
Gets all holidays off
Joined APC: Feb 2005
Position: Retired UPS 767 Captain, SDF Z
Posts: 431
After almost 17 years as a line pilot here at UPS, and three type ratings flying all the aircraft in question, teaching both in the sim and on the line, I think that an entry level job as a DC8 FO is actually more demanding than the highly automated, also unforgiving below 50 feet, MD11.
Now, does that make you feel better?
06-07-2007, 09:10 AM
#67
Gets all holidays off
Joined APC: Feb 2005
Position: Retired UPS 767 Captain, SDF Z
Posts: 431
We've had our fair share of incidents, and buffoonery on the mad dog here at brown too.
When we were a relatively "new" fleet here two years ago, a combination of landing currency issues, tail scrapes, over-runs, and a hard nose wheel de-rotation triggered a LOT of brainstorming in manglement and line instructors on how to address these important issues. When our flight standards and safety guys talked to their purple counterparts, we all came to the conclusion that our lack of class A incidents was due to LUCK. When the line instructors were told this at our standards meeting, I have to admit I agreed with that assessment.
Now, I also believe one makes one's own luck. Whatever it is that brown does in hiring, training, checking, AQP, tea leaf reading, and incense burning helps in the creation of our luck. I am not advocating that what brown does is better than Federal, so don't get defensive on me.
The BEST way the "issues" of the MD11 can be addressed and overcome is through continued exchange of data and ideas between our safety and training reps (union).
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