nightfreight

Hey Collins,

Get me some coffee! Protect essential.....

Give me a break.. My heart bleeds for him...

Busboy

From a previous post ...http://blogs.usatoday.com/oped/2007/...ing_.html#more...

Oh my goodness!

We are losing 5 experienced pilots a day? Gosh...At that rate, with my measely 22yrs of airline experience, I would be a super senior capt by the end of the year. And, that's if they all came from FDX.

LOOKOUT BELOW!!! We've got a youngster at the wheel!!!

Luckily that "5 pilots per day" loss is spread throughout the industry. We can all relax now.

RedeyeAV8r

Simply Put a change in AGE 60 will affect everyone 59 and Under Negatively with respect to moving up the list from Attrition.

That is Going to Happen. So No maater what, you are going to be affected negatively. I'm sorry but Get used to it.

Now if the over 60 active pilots on the FDX list (i'm told there are 161 of them) are allowed to bid back to the front seats, that would also have a negative affect.

I guess you need to see how many Fedex pilots are senior to you and worst case (unlikely but lets look at worst case) all 161 over 60 Second Officers are healthy and savvy enough to pass checkrides and physicals. That 161 is a burp (ones years retirement #'s over your whole career) compared to all the other 59 and younger that will soon be able to work past 60. The 59 and younger numbers are far greater than the 161. So the retro thing, while negative, is not as BIG as AGE 65 as a whole.

In my opinion while all this is negative, we need to focus on more important things that will affect us all Much more negatively. And might I add we will need to be unified to do so.

Pension laws......nobody want to be foreced to work past 60.

Open Skies....... a bigger threat to your seat movement. If US Airlines do not grow, guess what you don't move up either. Open Skies has the potentail to affect all of us negatively. President Bush is trying to agree to open skies with China.

License Harmonization: Probably the Biggest and worst threat of all to anyone with more than 10 years to go. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see what has happend to the Bulk of US manufacturing Jobs. They have all but ben eliminated by cheaper foriegn labor. Do any of you really think that our Generous Airline CEO's aren't already running the numbers on a Chineses Pilot willing to fly a 747 for $50,000 USD a year.

While I agree AGE 60 isn't a good thng for most of us, it is the smaller issue in the coming threats. Don't get too distracted from the real threats that are coming all of which could make AGE seem insignificant.


Hope that was a fair expalnation.

DiamondZ

Redeye,

Thanks for your explanations.

Not trying to be stubborn but it seems all of the items stated will happen with the Age 60 change. I think its safe to say that the majority of members are willing to accept the change.

I'm trying to figure out why the fight to change the proposed rule from prospective to retroactive.

How would prospective destroy the seniority system?

RedeyeAV8r

Hey no problem, I always enjoy a cicilized debate.

To answer to your last question
"How would proactive destroy the seniority system?

I can't speak for the opinions of DW or MEC.

This is my take and maybe someone else will chime in if I am on the mark.

ALPA has been consistently against any change to AGE 60......until recently.
Now due to events we have seen posted on this forum there is a real Possibilty that the ALPA Executive Board will vote to change ALPA's official position this week.

I won't rehash the reasons that ALPA leadership seems to be reconsiding it's position.

What I believe the FedEx MEC is saying, is Hey we are all really opposed to the change, but if we are going to reverse our position to now be For a Change, we must do so with ALL the Active members in mind.

MOST of the ALPA "A" group carriers no longer have any over 60 crewmembers because all their "3 Holers" haqve been retired. So retro activity of active crew memebers really doesn't change things for them. In other words it really doesn't affect them more negatively.
NWA is the only other Group A carrier with over 60 FE's. They still have a few 747-200's and from what I gather the NEW MEC is Still voteing to oppose AGE 60.

Realize the the FDX MEC Chair is just one vote of several on the Executive Board ALPA wide.


I think the FedEx MEC is saying we are a Union and any decision we make must include everyone on the List.........period.

That is my take

AerisArmis

Your photo on a national newspaper with a dopey look on your face and no tie, priceless! Wonder if "O" will have any words of encouragement for him?

MD11Fr8Dog

you meant prospective to retroactive, right?

My take is, it isn't whether the ruling becomes prospective or retroactive that undermines our seniority system. Its what our position prior to the ruling/legislation is that could hurt us. If we take a position that is willing to sell out a subset of the Master Seniority List, we give the company and/or lawyers a crack in our armor to work later - on this issue, and other untold issues. Look out for them, no matter the outcome, we protect the cornerstone issue of seniority. Best case scenario, we fight for the ropes seniority rights and lose. We never get all that we want anyway, right?

Albief15

I will agree Redeye has shown a lot of class and been a good source of info and perspective.

Just like about 95% of our crew force...even the old guys

DiamondZ

Yes. Fortunately I dont rely on my english / grammar to pay my bills.

BlueOnBlue

I have been a longtime lurker on this board and this is my first post but i would like to add my input to the over 60 argument. let me begin by saying i am an over 50 widebody captain with twenty years at the company and however this plays out, it is not going to have much affect on my fedex career. Alpa national has surveyed us and determined that if change to the over 60 rule is inevitable (which i believe to be true) then Alpa should drop its opposition to that rule. by not opposing the change they seek to have more influence on how the change is implemented. how that influence (on Congress and leglislation or on the FAA by regulation) is excercised is unclear to me. what is clear to me is that we, as members, have every right to determine how fedex and alpa national bring that influence to bear on the leglislative or regulatory process. retroactivity is only an issue if regulation or law make it an issue. i am an absolute believer in the seniority system. however, seniority as it applies from a company negotiated contractual process is an entirely different animal than changes to the seniority system (as we know it) that arise from regulatory or leglislative change. if you are opposed to retroactivity then i urge you to contact your block reps and the MEC and let them know how you feel. i don't think that our union has a clear idea of the numbers of us opposed to retroactivity.