A future in aviation? I have some questions.
12-24-2015, 08:52 AM
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2013
Position: Left
Posts: 644
Yes, I would get started at a local flight training operation. Get your feet damp towards a Pvt pilot license.
You will almost need a 4 yr degree, though there may be a few exceptions.
Keep your driving record clean along the way too.
You will almost need a 4 yr degree, though there may be a few exceptions.
Keep your driving record clean along the way too.
12-24-2015, 09:02 AM
#12
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: Window seat
Posts: 5,527
1) Does the college degree you receive impact airline hiring decisions? I heard getting a degree is just proof that you can make a commitment to airlines, is this true?
1. Get your degree. In anything. As part of a backup plan, or second job interest while working as a pilot, is the best plan.
2) Do well know aviation colleges such as Embry Riddle influences hiring decisions?
2. No. It shows long term aviation interest but by the time you get hired by a major it's a tiny part of your overall resume.
-Follow up to #2: If you went to Embry Riddle, can you tell me which one you went to (Daytona Beach or Prescott) and your overall impression and experience in college? Also, if you went to Embry Riddle Prescott, where was the airport you trained out of?
3. DAB. Visited Prescott. Small campus. Small town. Small airport. It's about five miles north of town.
3) Could you go through your typical schedule on a work day? (Hours in advance you prepare, get to the airport, preflight check, and flight.)
3. I try to get to the parking lot two hours before departure. That's one hour before sign-in. Gives a bit of pad for traffic, etc. If it's a early departure I reduce the pad because traffic problems are low risk at 0500-0600.
4) Layovers constantly allude me; what is a typical overnight stay like? do you have time to visit and travel around and how long is a normal layover (Overnighters and not-overnighters?) Do you pay for your housing or hotel on a layover or is that based on your airliner? Is the hotel usually descent? How would an international layover differ from a regional layover?
4. Domestically there's probably three general types of layovers - min time which normally involves a quick bite and sleep, or sleep and a quick bite the next morning. If you have a longer than min time layover you'll have time on the arrival day, or departure day, to do stuff. Tourist stuff, shopping, exercise, visit friends/family, work on projects, schoolwork, second job, military paperwork, union work, are all common events.
With w/b flying layovers in foreign cities, especially Europe, involves tourist stuff. The reality is the down side is the 'international hangover', you'll be tired. On a Europe trip you tend to go to sleep about 0400 body time, take a 2-4 nap, and then get up and play tourist for 4-6 hrs. Dinner, drinks, back to sleep, and a 0100-0300 body time wake-up for the flight back. So Europe is cool but there's a price to pay that comes with the cool factor.
5) Could you describe your experiences after college? How many years you had to work before you got a job as a pilot, how long it took you to become a captain, and how long it took to get hired by a legacy?
5. Started working full time as a pilot in my junior year. Took 5.5 years to graduate due to full time work conflict with part time college. This was before online and video streaming of courses. I was offered flying jobs before I had my commercial license - "keep doing well and we'll hire you." That happened twice before I started my junior year of college.
Time to Captain? At a corporation? A year(senior in college). Hired by a legacy? From when? First flying lessons? 8+ years. From first flying job? 7 years. From college degree? Four years. Time to Captain at a major? Six years.
6) My parents are really skeptical about me becoming a pilot and the initial investment we need to put forth for a profession that may soon die off. Has advancements in computer technology posed a risk for pilot jobs in the near future or is a transition to a fully automated cockpit a long way away?
6. Avg college cost is $80-100K in state. Community college then in state can reduce the cost. Increases income avg from $40,000/yr (HS degree) to about $65,000. $80,000 at ATP gets you a comm/inst/CFI in 180 days and you're in the job market racking up flight time (while doing college part time). Early on the financial rewards are tough but eventually you'll make more financial returns from your pilot education than the typical college graduate makes from their college investment instead of just getting a H.S. degree. Read the tread in this section about days worked and income earned. Keep in mind the typical guy spends a minimum of 6-8 years to get one with a major airline so when they're talking about year two pay it's really year 8-10 of their flying career. But these are the successful guys. Would you be happy if you're only making $60,000 flying a small turboprop around for a local company? And due to the retirement bubble coming the odds of being one of the successful guys is better now than it has been for the last 15 years.
7) What do you do while you are flying? Are you constantly sharp and checking your dashboard or is it ok to relax a little by listening to music?
7. Music is an option on long haul flights overwater. Instead of having to listen to the ATC radios you call them at specific points and times. Domestically it's impossible. Some guys have the headsets that stop the music when ATC talks but I have to think that must be brutal to listen too with the amount of radio chatter that's out there. So music listeners aren't common. You can relax but there's minor stuff going on. Guys take breaks and read something at times, do a crossword puzzle, Sudoku, or talk about their interests or hobbies. Lots of sharp coworkers so learning their areas of interest/expertise can be enlightening.
8) Why did you become a pilot and what pushed you to investigate a career in aviation?
8. Dad was a pilot. He flew gliders in the summer when I was a kid. Took me up. I enjoyed it. He mentioned glider summer course. I took it. Paralyzing fear on the first flight, learned to overcome it. Did nothing with flying for two years then took standard H.S. career tests. Guidance officer said "ever think of being a pilot?" Dad came home from a trip and I told him I was looking into Embry-Riddle. Surprised the heck out of him since he didn't know I knew ERAU existed. The more I got into it the more I enjoyed the profession, even at the bottom end starting out humping bags in the rain.
9) Do you regret becoming a pilot? If you were to go back in time, would you still want to become a pilot when you get older?
9. Is that a trick question? Regrets? No. I wouldn't trade my career for another one.
10) What were some of the biggest surprises (good and bad) that you encountered as an airline pilot?
10. You'll have to overcome fear. If you can't get past that you'll struggle. Spins, upside down, G's, winch tows, confidence maneuvers (70 degrees nose high and run the airplane out of airspeed until it stalls and flops around like a flounder duck), negative G's, diving at the ground (fighters), the speed of jets(yup, some guys quit, or go back to slower a/c), overheard patterns in the T-38(plane's chattering due to airflow separation....ie, it's talking to you), formation flight, etc, etc, are all momentums that give various people pause.
The upside? The quality of your coworkers. Lots of really good professionals you'll work with. Another upside - seeing the world from 35,000. The views can be amazing. Or seeing the world from 100'. Or 50'. Or 20'. OK, I'm lying, at 20' you're not taking in the view. You're watching your nose position because a slight dip could ruin your day, fast! And the views can be amazing, especially over sailboats. ;-)
11) What recommendations would you give to a 16 year old to help him become a pilot if he hasn't had any experience flying a plane?
11. Get airborne. It's different. And at times harder than people realize. If it was super easy everyone would do it. Niece was super achiever in H.S. and college. In shape. Went to UPT. Lost 10-15 lbs due to stress. "Hardest thing I've done in my life."
11. Since the longest time line event you're have to achieve prior to being a viable candidate for a major job is your total flight time, if I was joining the game today, I'd focus on getting my pilot licenses first. Take college courses in H.S. AP courses and test out and get college credit. Then go to pilot puppy mill school and get your licenses in 180 days. You'd be 19 yrs old, or even 18, and flying for a living. Then do college part time/online while working full time. Get on the time line of having your four year degree ASAP. Do 2-3 courses year-round and you'll achieve it in under 5 yrs. At 1500 hrs you'll get on with a regional airline. On this time line you'd be about 21 yrs old. With the right effort, timing, and luck, you could be looking at upgrading at the regional about the same time you get your college degree and 5,000 hrs TT. That professional resume, and the focus that you bring to yourself to achieve those goals, will position you to get hired in your mid to late 20's at a major airline due to the current retirement bubble.
Thanks you so much for your answers, you don't know how much these answers will help! Happy holidays and sorry that this post was so long![/QUOTE]
Congratulations on your interest. Good luck on trying to align desires with the effort needed. Lots of people achieve their goals but there's also a lot of people who don't. Part of maturing is achieving goals realistic to your own personal drive and abilities.
Oh, don't be stupid. Drugs, DWI, etc, etc. It's just a bad idea. What many of us did growing up is just unacceptable in today's society. If you think it will be a good story at an interview go ahead and do it. If you don't think it will be a good story at an interview...stop. Wise instructor at AA always said "start at the hearing and work backwards."
1. Get your degree. In anything. As part of a backup plan, or second job interest while working as a pilot, is the best plan.
2) Do well know aviation colleges such as Embry Riddle influences hiring decisions?
2. No. It shows long term aviation interest but by the time you get hired by a major it's a tiny part of your overall resume.
-Follow up to #2: If you went to Embry Riddle, can you tell me which one you went to (Daytona Beach or Prescott) and your overall impression and experience in college? Also, if you went to Embry Riddle Prescott, where was the airport you trained out of?
3. DAB. Visited Prescott. Small campus. Small town. Small airport. It's about five miles north of town.
3) Could you go through your typical schedule on a work day? (Hours in advance you prepare, get to the airport, preflight check, and flight.)
3. I try to get to the parking lot two hours before departure. That's one hour before sign-in. Gives a bit of pad for traffic, etc. If it's a early departure I reduce the pad because traffic problems are low risk at 0500-0600.
4) Layovers constantly allude me; what is a typical overnight stay like? do you have time to visit and travel around and how long is a normal layover (Overnighters and not-overnighters?) Do you pay for your housing or hotel on a layover or is that based on your airliner? Is the hotel usually descent? How would an international layover differ from a regional layover?
4. Domestically there's probably three general types of layovers - min time which normally involves a quick bite and sleep, or sleep and a quick bite the next morning. If you have a longer than min time layover you'll have time on the arrival day, or departure day, to do stuff. Tourist stuff, shopping, exercise, visit friends/family, work on projects, schoolwork, second job, military paperwork, union work, are all common events.
With w/b flying layovers in foreign cities, especially Europe, involves tourist stuff. The reality is the down side is the 'international hangover', you'll be tired. On a Europe trip you tend to go to sleep about 0400 body time, take a 2-4 nap, and then get up and play tourist for 4-6 hrs. Dinner, drinks, back to sleep, and a 0100-0300 body time wake-up for the flight back. So Europe is cool but there's a price to pay that comes with the cool factor.
5) Could you describe your experiences after college? How many years you had to work before you got a job as a pilot, how long it took you to become a captain, and how long it took to get hired by a legacy?
5. Started working full time as a pilot in my junior year. Took 5.5 years to graduate due to full time work conflict with part time college. This was before online and video streaming of courses. I was offered flying jobs before I had my commercial license - "keep doing well and we'll hire you." That happened twice before I started my junior year of college.
Time to Captain? At a corporation? A year(senior in college). Hired by a legacy? From when? First flying lessons? 8+ years. From first flying job? 7 years. From college degree? Four years. Time to Captain at a major? Six years.
6) My parents are really skeptical about me becoming a pilot and the initial investment we need to put forth for a profession that may soon die off. Has advancements in computer technology posed a risk for pilot jobs in the near future or is a transition to a fully automated cockpit a long way away?
6. Avg college cost is $80-100K in state. Community college then in state can reduce the cost. Increases income avg from $40,000/yr (HS degree) to about $65,000. $80,000 at ATP gets you a comm/inst/CFI in 180 days and you're in the job market racking up flight time (while doing college part time). Early on the financial rewards are tough but eventually you'll make more financial returns from your pilot education than the typical college graduate makes from their college investment instead of just getting a H.S. degree. Read the tread in this section about days worked and income earned. Keep in mind the typical guy spends a minimum of 6-8 years to get one with a major airline so when they're talking about year two pay it's really year 8-10 of their flying career. But these are the successful guys. Would you be happy if you're only making $60,000 flying a small turboprop around for a local company? And due to the retirement bubble coming the odds of being one of the successful guys is better now than it has been for the last 15 years.
7) What do you do while you are flying? Are you constantly sharp and checking your dashboard or is it ok to relax a little by listening to music?
7. Music is an option on long haul flights overwater. Instead of having to listen to the ATC radios you call them at specific points and times. Domestically it's impossible. Some guys have the headsets that stop the music when ATC talks but I have to think that must be brutal to listen too with the amount of radio chatter that's out there. So music listeners aren't common. You can relax but there's minor stuff going on. Guys take breaks and read something at times, do a crossword puzzle, Sudoku, or talk about their interests or hobbies. Lots of sharp coworkers so learning their areas of interest/expertise can be enlightening.
8) Why did you become a pilot and what pushed you to investigate a career in aviation?
8. Dad was a pilot. He flew gliders in the summer when I was a kid. Took me up. I enjoyed it. He mentioned glider summer course. I took it. Paralyzing fear on the first flight, learned to overcome it. Did nothing with flying for two years then took standard H.S. career tests. Guidance officer said "ever think of being a pilot?" Dad came home from a trip and I told him I was looking into Embry-Riddle. Surprised the heck out of him since he didn't know I knew ERAU existed. The more I got into it the more I enjoyed the profession, even at the bottom end starting out humping bags in the rain.
9) Do you regret becoming a pilot? If you were to go back in time, would you still want to become a pilot when you get older?
9. Is that a trick question? Regrets? No. I wouldn't trade my career for another one.
10) What were some of the biggest surprises (good and bad) that you encountered as an airline pilot?
10. You'll have to overcome fear. If you can't get past that you'll struggle. Spins, upside down, G's, winch tows, confidence maneuvers (70 degrees nose high and run the airplane out of airspeed until it stalls and flops around like a flounder duck), negative G's, diving at the ground (fighters), the speed of jets(yup, some guys quit, or go back to slower a/c), overheard patterns in the T-38(plane's chattering due to airflow separation....ie, it's talking to you), formation flight, etc, etc, are all momentums that give various people pause.
The upside? The quality of your coworkers. Lots of really good professionals you'll work with. Another upside - seeing the world from 35,000. The views can be amazing. Or seeing the world from 100'. Or 50'. Or 20'. OK, I'm lying, at 20' you're not taking in the view. You're watching your nose position because a slight dip could ruin your day, fast! And the views can be amazing, especially over sailboats. ;-)
11) What recommendations would you give to a 16 year old to help him become a pilot if he hasn't had any experience flying a plane?
11. Get airborne. It's different. And at times harder than people realize. If it was super easy everyone would do it. Niece was super achiever in H.S. and college. In shape. Went to UPT. Lost 10-15 lbs due to stress. "Hardest thing I've done in my life."
11. Since the longest time line event you're have to achieve prior to being a viable candidate for a major job is your total flight time, if I was joining the game today, I'd focus on getting my pilot licenses first. Take college courses in H.S. AP courses and test out and get college credit. Then go to pilot puppy mill school and get your licenses in 180 days. You'd be 19 yrs old, or even 18, and flying for a living. Then do college part time/online while working full time. Get on the time line of having your four year degree ASAP. Do 2-3 courses year-round and you'll achieve it in under 5 yrs. At 1500 hrs you'll get on with a regional airline. On this time line you'd be about 21 yrs old. With the right effort, timing, and luck, you could be looking at upgrading at the regional about the same time you get your college degree and 5,000 hrs TT. That professional resume, and the focus that you bring to yourself to achieve those goals, will position you to get hired in your mid to late 20's at a major airline due to the current retirement bubble.
Thanks you so much for your answers, you don't know how much these answers will help! Happy holidays and sorry that this post was so long![/QUOTE]
Congratulations on your interest. Good luck on trying to align desires with the effort needed. Lots of people achieve their goals but there's also a lot of people who don't. Part of maturing is achieving goals realistic to your own personal drive and abilities.
Oh, don't be stupid. Drugs, DWI, etc, etc. It's just a bad idea. What many of us did growing up is just unacceptable in today's society. If you think it will be a good story at an interview go ahead and do it. If you don't think it will be a good story at an interview...stop. Wise instructor at AA always said "start at the hearing and work backwards."
12-24-2015, 09:06 AM
#13
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2015
Posts: 333
Hi I am 16 and am interested in a career being a pilot and had a few questions regarding the profession. I haven't had any formal flight training yet but I am hoping to have some soon and I don't know many pilots that I could talk to so I came to this forum. Even if you cannot answer all of these questions, please answer the ones you can because all of your answers would be awesome and greatly appreciated!
1) Does the college degree you receive impact airline hiring decisions? I heard getting a degree is just proof that you can make a commitment to airlines, is this true?
2) Do well know aviation colleges such as Embry Riddle influences hiring decisions?
-Follow up to #2: If you went to Embry Riddle, can you tell me which one you went to (Daytona Beach or Prescott) and your overall impression and experience in college? Also, if you went to Embry Riddle Prescott, where was the airport you trained out of?
3) Could you go through your typical schedule on a work day? (Hours in advance you prepare, get to the airport, preflight check, and flight.)
4) Layovers constantly allude me; what is a typical overnight stay like? do you have time to visit and travel around and how long is a normal layover (Overnighters and not-overnighters?) Do you pay for your housing or hotel on a layover or is that based on your airliner? Is the hotel usually descent? How would an international layover differ from a regional layover?
5) Could you describe your experiences after college? How many years you had to work before you got a job as a pilot, how long it took you to become a captain, and how long it took to get hired by a legacy?
6) My parents are really skeptical about me becoming a pilot and the initial investment we need to put forth for a profession that may soon die off. Has advancements in computer technology posed a risk for pilot jobs in the near future or is a transition to a fully automated cockpit a long way away?
7) What do you do while you are flying? Are you constantly sharp and checking your dashboard or is it ok to relax a little by listening to music?
8) Why did you become a pilot and what pushed you to investigate a career in aviation?
9) Do you regret becoming a pilot? If you were to go back in time, would you still want to become a pilot when you get older?
10) What were some of the biggest surprises (good and bad) that you encountered as an airline pilot?
11) What recommendations would you give to a 16 year old to help him become a pilot if he hasn't had any experience flying a plane?
Thanks you so much for your answers, you don't know how much these answers will help! Happy holidays and sorry that this post was so long!
1) Does the college degree you receive impact airline hiring decisions? I heard getting a degree is just proof that you can make a commitment to airlines, is this true?
2) Do well know aviation colleges such as Embry Riddle influences hiring decisions?
-Follow up to #2: If you went to Embry Riddle, can you tell me which one you went to (Daytona Beach or Prescott) and your overall impression and experience in college? Also, if you went to Embry Riddle Prescott, where was the airport you trained out of?
3) Could you go through your typical schedule on a work day? (Hours in advance you prepare, get to the airport, preflight check, and flight.)
4) Layovers constantly allude me; what is a typical overnight stay like? do you have time to visit and travel around and how long is a normal layover (Overnighters and not-overnighters?) Do you pay for your housing or hotel on a layover or is that based on your airliner? Is the hotel usually descent? How would an international layover differ from a regional layover?
5) Could you describe your experiences after college? How many years you had to work before you got a job as a pilot, how long it took you to become a captain, and how long it took to get hired by a legacy?
6) My parents are really skeptical about me becoming a pilot and the initial investment we need to put forth for a profession that may soon die off. Has advancements in computer technology posed a risk for pilot jobs in the near future or is a transition to a fully automated cockpit a long way away?
7) What do you do while you are flying? Are you constantly sharp and checking your dashboard or is it ok to relax a little by listening to music?
8) Why did you become a pilot and what pushed you to investigate a career in aviation?
9) Do you regret becoming a pilot? If you were to go back in time, would you still want to become a pilot when you get older?
10) What were some of the biggest surprises (good and bad) that you encountered as an airline pilot?
11) What recommendations would you give to a 16 year old to help him become a pilot if he hasn't had any experience flying a plane?
Thanks you so much for your answers, you don't know how much these answers will help! Happy holidays and sorry that this post was so long!
12-24-2015, 10:09 AM
#14
done, gone skiing
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Rocking chair
Posts: 1,602
You will find a lot of suggestions and opinion regarding aviation, both as a hobby (love) and vocation on this and other aviation forums and websites. Read, ask and learn.
I would suggest besides spending your hard saved (grassing cutting??) money or mom and dad's generosity, that you just spent time at your local airport. If you have options as to which one near you, smaller is better, but busy (as in small plane) is even better. Ask what positions might be available as far as work (don't hold your breath that you'll get anything, but show interest and try), other than that, bum around. The lounge of the flight school, the front desk where the transit flights come through, if allowed, walk around the flight line/hangers. Ask questions, show interest and pilots/owners will be happy to show you their plane. Don't expect a ride but then again, if you spent enough time and meet the same people over and over, things will happen.
All this will cost you nothing but your time and interest and could help you decide if you want to further pursue flying in the future.
I would suggest besides spending your hard saved (grassing cutting??) money or mom and dad's generosity, that you just spent time at your local airport. If you have options as to which one near you, smaller is better, but busy (as in small plane) is even better. Ask what positions might be available as far as work (don't hold your breath that you'll get anything, but show interest and try), other than that, bum around. The lounge of the flight school, the front desk where the transit flights come through, if allowed, walk around the flight line/hangers. Ask questions, show interest and pilots/owners will be happy to show you their plane. Don't expect a ride but then again, if you spent enough time and meet the same people over and over, things will happen.
All this will cost you nothing but your time and interest and could help you decide if you want to further pursue flying in the future.
12-24-2015, 12:57 PM
#15
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2010
Position: Baja Vermont
Posts: 5,197
Go to work at the local airport as a "line boy"; that made my start right.
Your timing is perfect, when you acquire the college degree, the license, the experience; the current hiring boom will be winding down and you'll be on the leading edge of the next decade of stagnation--the '70s, then the 00's, next up the late '20s to '30s. That's a feature, not a bug, in any seniority-based system. My father was right--being an airline pilot is a lot about luck like being a pro ball player.
GF
Your timing is perfect, when you acquire the college degree, the license, the experience; the current hiring boom will be winding down and you'll be on the leading edge of the next decade of stagnation--the '70s, then the 00's, next up the late '20s to '30s. That's a feature, not a bug, in any seniority-based system. My father was right--being an airline pilot is a lot about luck like being a pro ball player.
GF
12-24-2015, 01:59 PM
#16
On Reserve
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Dec 2015
Posts: 16
Currently it is a factor, not necessarily at the regional level but as you move on to the major airlines. It is a requirement at most to have a degree but I imagine that will start to fade as the pool of qualified applicants and flow-thrus start to dwindle. A degree makes you more competitive at most places where it isn't a requirement, but there are exceptions to that. Besides, why would you want to skip 4 years of making stupid decisions in front of girls your age in a parent-free atmosphere!? I learned some of life's most important lessons in college!
In my opinion it does very little towards giving you an advantage in hiring. I think it's an over-priced degree that is worthless in most respects. Also, it invalidates my argument above, the part about 'making stupid decisions in the presence of girls your age'. Skip ER and go to a state college and get a business degree. Learn to fly on the side. A lot less money and a lot more fun. For the same amount of money at ER you can become a doctor.
I typically fly 3 day and occasionally 4 day trips. Most days are 7-10 hours with 2-3 legs. Overnights are typically 12-18 hours. I commute so I leave about 5 hours before checkin. It's 3-4 hours to either drive or jumpseat to work. We check in one hour before departure and update our charts (all electronic now, iPad, 2 apps, sync both and done). I'll wander down to the gate, usually stopping to grab a snack or two, and then get to the plane 45 minutes before departure. Meet the crew, walk around, and then start loading the flight plan or bs-ing with the Captain and crew. Well, who am I kidding, I'm always bs-ing with Captain and crew.
Most layovers are 12-18 hours. The hotel is provided by the company, single occupancy unless you have some game. They're typically located near restaurants, bars and shopping. Long overnights (over 16 hours) are typically in a downtown area. You've got time for a nice meal, some walking around, maybe a few beverages if the time is right. As you get more senior, the cities get nicer and take longer to get to. First it's Allentown, Panama City, Flint, then it's Boston, San Francisco, New York, then it's Paris, London and Tokyo. I'm always looking for the little hole-in-the-wall local restaurant/pub, there's a world of food to discover.
I changed careers so it took me some time before I got into flying. I was at a small commuter for a few months then a large regional for 9 years and then a legacy that merged with another. We're a ways off from single pilot operations. There are so many redundancies built into the system that it'll take years before the FAA will sign off on removing a pilot. The single biggest advancement I've seen in my short 13 years is that we're using iPads for our manuals. There are planes flying around that were built in the 60's. Yeah, the autopilot does a great job flying straight and level, descending, etc, but there is countless interaction between pilot and airplane even when that part is automated. Hell, we can't taxi off the ramp with intervening somewhere in the process. Remote control with cameras???! Yeah, right!
No, you don't really sit back and relax and listen to music. You're talking with the other guy, waiting for your crew meal, watching where you're going, talking to ATC and maybe perusing a magazine cough cough, or book (aviation related of course). It's not as boring as you think, compared to say, sitting in a cubicle writing code and looking out the window in to the sky, like I did for 10 years.
Read above paragraph, sitting in a cubicle writing code...
This job has made me unemployable in any other job. Wait, you mean I need to sit at this desk for 8 hours today and be productive!? No way. There is so much freedom in the confines of a 3 day trip that you can't imagine going back to a job where you are accountable daily to meetings, emails, phone calls etc. When you're flying, you're doing your work and you aren't even thinking about it. There is no slacking off because it's so regimented and results oriented, I'm flying from A to B and this is everything I do to do that. When I worked for a large corporation in IT, it was exactly like the movie Office Space, we would dwadle about trying to waste time to get thru the morning so we could get to lunch, I produced maybe 15 minutes of real work in the first 3 hours, I'm not kidding!
Go to your local small airport and take an introductory ride with a small flying school. It typically costs less than $100 and you'll know immediately if it is for you. It's like crack after that, you can't stop until you're sitting in the left seat wondering where the last 20 years went!
Personally, I think it's one of the best careers out there. I see some that have only flown and have never had another career and it's hard for them to compare. I worked for a small company and a large corporation before becoming a pilot so I feel like I've got a different perspective. I can't imagine doing anything else so now the goal is to stay healthy and try to fly it out. Good luck!
In my opinion it does very little towards giving you an advantage in hiring. I think it's an over-priced degree that is worthless in most respects. Also, it invalidates my argument above, the part about 'making stupid decisions in the presence of girls your age'. Skip ER and go to a state college and get a business degree. Learn to fly on the side. A lot less money and a lot more fun. For the same amount of money at ER you can become a doctor.
I typically fly 3 day and occasionally 4 day trips. Most days are 7-10 hours with 2-3 legs. Overnights are typically 12-18 hours. I commute so I leave about 5 hours before checkin. It's 3-4 hours to either drive or jumpseat to work. We check in one hour before departure and update our charts (all electronic now, iPad, 2 apps, sync both and done). I'll wander down to the gate, usually stopping to grab a snack or two, and then get to the plane 45 minutes before departure. Meet the crew, walk around, and then start loading the flight plan or bs-ing with the Captain and crew. Well, who am I kidding, I'm always bs-ing with Captain and crew.
Most layovers are 12-18 hours. The hotel is provided by the company, single occupancy unless you have some game. They're typically located near restaurants, bars and shopping. Long overnights (over 16 hours) are typically in a downtown area. You've got time for a nice meal, some walking around, maybe a few beverages if the time is right. As you get more senior, the cities get nicer and take longer to get to. First it's Allentown, Panama City, Flint, then it's Boston, San Francisco, New York, then it's Paris, London and Tokyo. I'm always looking for the little hole-in-the-wall local restaurant/pub, there's a world of food to discover.
I changed careers so it took me some time before I got into flying. I was at a small commuter for a few months then a large regional for 9 years and then a legacy that merged with another. We're a ways off from single pilot operations. There are so many redundancies built into the system that it'll take years before the FAA will sign off on removing a pilot. The single biggest advancement I've seen in my short 13 years is that we're using iPads for our manuals. There are planes flying around that were built in the 60's. Yeah, the autopilot does a great job flying straight and level, descending, etc, but there is countless interaction between pilot and airplane even when that part is automated. Hell, we can't taxi off the ramp with intervening somewhere in the process. Remote control with cameras???! Yeah, right!
No, you don't really sit back and relax and listen to music. You're talking with the other guy, waiting for your crew meal, watching where you're going, talking to ATC and maybe perusing a magazine cough cough, or book (aviation related of course). It's not as boring as you think, compared to say, sitting in a cubicle writing code and looking out the window in to the sky, like I did for 10 years.
Read above paragraph, sitting in a cubicle writing code...
This job has made me unemployable in any other job. Wait, you mean I need to sit at this desk for 8 hours today and be productive!? No way. There is so much freedom in the confines of a 3 day trip that you can't imagine going back to a job where you are accountable daily to meetings, emails, phone calls etc. When you're flying, you're doing your work and you aren't even thinking about it. There is no slacking off because it's so regimented and results oriented, I'm flying from A to B and this is everything I do to do that. When I worked for a large corporation in IT, it was exactly like the movie Office Space, we would dwadle about trying to waste time to get thru the morning so we could get to lunch, I produced maybe 15 minutes of real work in the first 3 hours, I'm not kidding!
Go to your local small airport and take an introductory ride with a small flying school. It typically costs less than $100 and you'll know immediately if it is for you. It's like crack after that, you can't stop until you're sitting in the left seat wondering where the last 20 years went!
Personally, I think it's one of the best careers out there. I see some that have only flown and have never had another career and it's hard for them to compare. I worked for a small company and a large corporation before becoming a pilot so I feel like I've got a different perspective. I can't imagine doing anything else so now the goal is to stay healthy and try to fly it out. Good luck!
12-24-2015, 02:05 PM
#17
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What a fantastic, funny and spot on post by SilverandSore, one that I would vote for post of the day.
The only difference I would add is a different perspective on getting to a flying career. I did mine in the military. They paid for my training and paid me at the same time. It's a great way to learn how to fly, but it's EXTREMELY competitive to get in these days, not like it was when I was accepted to pilot training.
Either way, an airline career is a great career, I couldn't imagine myself doing anything else.
Best of luck in what you decide young man, the smartest thing your doing is gathering information and trying to make decisions at such a young age. Most young adults do not do this and drift aimlessly. I applaud you.
The only difference I would add is a different perspective on getting to a flying career. I did mine in the military. They paid for my training and paid me at the same time. It's a great way to learn how to fly, but it's EXTREMELY competitive to get in these days, not like it was when I was accepted to pilot training.
Either way, an airline career is a great career, I couldn't imagine myself doing anything else.
Best of luck in what you decide young man, the smartest thing your doing is gathering information and trying to make decisions at such a young age. Most young adults do not do this and drift aimlessly. I applaud you.
12-24-2015, 02:07 PM
#18
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My advice would be to get a college degree in something other than aviation. Something with teeth in the real working world. You never know when your flying career will be derailed. Can't get a medical, strike, airline goes out of business, etc.. You need a fall back plan, even if it is temporary. Additionally, that fall back plan can help pay the bills in the beginning of your airline career when you make peanuts.
12-24-2015, 02:09 PM
#19
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Joined APC: May 2010
Position: Baja Vermont
Posts: 5,197
At your age, you really ought to look at a ANG or AFRC pilot training slot--it's the easiest way to slide into an airline career and serve your country. The networking, training and experience will be invaluable, absolutely no price can be put on it. Don't worry about not getting a UPT position, if you don't you will be discharged. By going to a UE unit you can select your mission and plane, too. Yes, the unit mission can change, but much of the turmoil is winding down. My old unit is already slated for KC-46s. Parents can have an opinion, but it's your life.
As to risk, life is full of it especially if you fly. You need to confirm your medical in any case.
An example of networking, when EAL folded in '89; a couple of phone calls and I had a new career. When military retirement was coming, a phone call to a former squadron member, I had a job flying a Global.
GF
As to risk, life is full of it especially if you fly. You need to confirm your medical in any case.
An example of networking, when EAL folded in '89; a couple of phone calls and I had a new career. When military retirement was coming, a phone call to a former squadron member, I had a job flying a Global.
GF
12-24-2015, 02:15 PM
#20
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I'll caveate this a bit. I wholeheartedly agree that you need to have a back up career path. This alternate path can certainly be aviation oriented, my alternate schooling is as an A&P, additionally my CFI has opened up opportunities outside of full time flying as well (my maintenance certifications helped me land almost every job I had before an airline). I am not recommending this specifically, just providing additional perspective.
First Class brings up an excellent point...Flight Physicals. I cannot stress this enough. As someone who has been through medical procedures that grounded me as an active pilot as well as dealing with the special issuance process, I strongly recommend that you make absolutely sure that you are medically qualified for a career path in aviation before pulling the trigger and spending tens of thousands of your (or your parents) dollars.
All the best in your career choices,
GP
First Class brings up an excellent point...Flight Physicals. I cannot stress this enough. As someone who has been through medical procedures that grounded me as an active pilot as well as dealing with the special issuance process, I strongly recommend that you make absolutely sure that you are medically qualified for a career path in aviation before pulling the trigger and spending tens of thousands of your (or your parents) dollars.
All the best in your career choices,
GP
Thanks for your reply and I am a little confused about the medical part of the job. I had a hard time finding the medical requirements and what a typical medical exam is for pilots (I looked at 14 CFR Part 67 and couldn't really understand it.) it just like a physical or is it more than that? Thanks for your answers!
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