Ellan Vannin

Ladies & gentlemen,

I am a brand new member here and I fully appreciate that I am also an absolute novice in the US aviation field and as such, I run the severe risk of asking what may seem obvious questions to the "experten" of the forum. All I ask is "Please be gentle!".

I am 44 yrs old and have been flying since 1997, with 3.5 years prior service as a flight attendant. I have over 6,500hrs TT, all commercial ME. Of that, around 2,500hrs are as PiC (Turboprops). I have 1300hrs in that total that are Jet time (P2/P1 u/s on Emb-145). No incidents, accidents or investigations and have an unrestricted Class 1 medical. I currently fly for a large Regional carrier.

Additionally, I work as a reserve Police Officer, an officer (Major) in the UK Army Reserve teaching cadets and am active in my church community. I mention these aspects as I am led to believe that these community-based factors are considered relevant, especially with the legacy carriers/majors.

My family and I have considered relocating several times before but the timing has never been right with either job opportunities or schooling etc. We have family (wife's siblings) in MD & CT but no other direct ties so we would need full "Green card" processing.

So, that's the background. Assuming you are still awake, my questions are:

1. ATPL conversion requirements recently changed but I have struggled to clarify the differences. From what I have read, I would need to do a Part 121 Airman's Knowledge Test and a checkride to gain an FAA ATP, in addition to a First Class Medical. Is this correct?

2. Assuming my statement above IS correct, where would be a suitable place to go for such a conversion or are the many apps on offer worth looking at? I presume I need to attend in person at a validated test centre rather than "just" a flying school?

3. With my qualifications above, is there a realistic chance of getting hired or even looked at by the majors? If so, is the "App" process the best way/only way forward?

4. I have heard a plethora of stories about working for the Regionals. Are they as bad as some make out? I'm used to regional flying and in theory, the lifestyle may be more suitable than long haul.

5. With my experience, what are the chances of being hired by a Regional as a DEC? If so, how do the salaries stack up? I've found the online information vague and conflicting so would rather hear from those within the industry.

I apologise for so many questions. We really want see if our plan is even worth pursuing. We love the US and feel that the lifestyle, especially for our children would be something we would love to embrace.

Thank you in advance for any assistance you may be able to give even if it's a case of "Don't even think about it!".

Twin Wasp

Well first, without a green card there is no way you can be hired so you'll have to work that out to get a job

1. There are a couple more steps. I'm guessing you hold some sort of CAA/JAR/EASA commercial or ATP license. Normally to get a FAA ATP you have to hold a FAA commercial. If you hold a foreign commercial with the required time or a foreign ATP you can step straight to the FAA ATP. You have to have your CAA verify your license to the FAA to do this. And you have to pass a TSA background check before you start any flight training for the ATP checkride. The main problem is you have to complete an ATP Certificate Training Program before you can take (sit) the ATP written. (The FAA does not issue pilot licenses. They certify you as a pilot and therefore you get a certificate, not a license.) The ATP CTP was designed for pilots coming out of CE-172s and going to RJs. For pilots coming out of the military or foreign pilots getting an ATP 95% of it is a waste of time. A year after the requirement went into effect there are only about half a dozen authorized providers of CTPs. They run about a week and cost about $5000.

2. Once you have the written out of the way there are hundreds flight schools were you could train for the ATP checkride. Something is lost in translation with "apps on offer."

3. I'd think you could get in at a major. But yes, you have to apply and that starts out on line now.

4. Regionals fly some of the same routes as majors, just smaller equipment and paychecks.

5. The only time you'd find a DEC job here is for a start-up company. EVERYTHING is done by seniority based on your date of hire.

Proximity

If I were you I'd do it.

I could go on for awhile about the issues with trying to make a flying career in the UK right now, but to sum it up, the opportunities are much better in the USA right now.

As pointed out, you cannot get hired as a DEC in the USA. However, this a good thing, as DECs in the long run are only good for the company. In the USA seniority is everything, it will decide what seat you sit in, what routes you fly, what equipment you fly, your vacation, and problem some things I can't think of right now. In the USA you have much more control over your working conditions compared to European carriers.

Your times are around what the major airlines are looking for, but getting hired at one of these can take some time and your going to face an issue because you are a 'special case', not a bog-standard 121 regional pilot or military pilot.

So what I'd recommend is to figure out where in the USA you might want to live, and get hired at the best (best being subjective to what you consider important) airline that will take you right away. The regionals are hurting and will take you as soon as you get your FAA ATP, but you should also consider places like Spirt, JetBlue, Virgin America, which are sort of half-way in-between regionals and majors. Even these places are somewhat difficult to get on with, so some regional flying to strength your profile will likely be the best option.

Something different from Europe compared to America, your not tied to your job like you are in the UK with 2-3 month notice periods. You can get a job at a regional and if you find something better just give them 2 weeks notice and move your better option.

The green card application is another complicated area, assuming your siblings are USA citizens there is no wait time to file for you. But even then there a couple different ways to do it, each with advantages and pitfalls.

canuckian

You'll need to look into the green card problem before anything else.
My mother is a U.S. citizen and it took me 12 years to get a green card, if I was sponsored by a sibling it would have been longer.

Google Visa priority date, I just checked U.K citizens sponsored by a sibling and they are processing applications from 2003. It would be the F4 category. Your wife would be the primary applicant and you and your children would be derivatives. There is talk of eliminating this category but if you apply now you will be grandfathered I believe. It doesn't hurt to submit the application, I had actually forgotten about mine it had been so long.

Good Luck

Ellan Vannin

Thanks for the good advice guys, much more of the reality stuff that I was looking for.

I should have stated - I do indeed hold an EASA (UK) ATPL. Whilst the UK market is relatively buoyant, my quality of life and that of my family has been significantly eroded with base closures etc.

I have obviously misjudged the Green Card situation, so the reality check is much appreciated. I was under the (mistaken) impression that I needed to apply for a job and if successful, the respective airline would be my sponsor. Obviously not the case. I therefore wonder if at 44 that perhaps I've left it too late? I shall look into that side of things in more depth.

I really appreciate the honest replies guys. It's exactly what I needed.

CareerSO

I'm also thinking of moving to the U.S, I have a green card currently flying the a330/a340/a350 (3500hrsTT). Is it possible or even likely to be able to join a major on a long haul fleet with this experience or is recruitment always onto a short haul fleet? Thanks

Twin Wasp

As stated above everything is based on seniority. What base you get, what aircraft you fly, the trips you fly, your vacation days, when you upgrade, everything. The junior person gets the life no one else wants. Usually sitting reserve for the smallest aircraft in the worst base in the system. But what is bad for one person is good for another. Some pilots who live in base bid reserve and hardly ever fly. If they are the senior pilot on reserve they can pass on a trip until they are the last pilot left to fly.

The short answer is there is a ~97% chance you could not bid international initially . But how long you are stuck at the bottom of the list depends on how many are hired below you and how many leave above you and how much the airline grows and shrinks.

CareerSO

Ok, many thanks for taking the time to explain - should help the decision making process.