aviatorhi

The problem is that this "fed ride" is being misconstrued as some sort of pass/fail event, it's and observation, plain and simple, first flight, last flight of IOE, etc. is irrelevant, it is a simple observation. Quit overthinking it.

USMCFLYR

I'm not thinking of it at all.
PerfInit pretty much said what you just said.
To the OP and others following.............I'd listen to the guy that actually conducts the rides.

Yep - Plain and simple.

PerfInit

For the benefit of all involved, here is the reference:

FAA Order 8900.1, Volume 6, Chapter 2, Section 20. See Paragraph 6-608.

EMJets

OK so it wasn't an actual pass/fail event? I'm trying to figure out if I need to report this to possible future employers when they ask about check rides and line checks.

It does not appear on my company PRIA report, and the check airmen involved said "it doesn't count as a failure".

For those savvy about this process, would there be anything about this in my FAA records?

Thanks

Rama

You are over thinking this. It is not a jeopardy event. As previously stated, it is an observation, not a check ride. It is an evaluation of the training specifically to see if the sim training carries over to line flying.

aviatorhi

I'd disagree with that, since PerfInit is making it seem like a "jeopardy" or "pass / fail" event, which it is not. Even according to his own guidance in the 8900. It is not treated as an "UNSAT" requiring remedial training, inability to complete a successful observation simply means OE continues, at the same time if the observation is conducted prior to meeting the requisite hours of OE then, while the check is complete, OE still continues.

This:

Is false according to this:

In regards to Paragraph 6-608 I've never been under the impression that every single "'Qualifying PIC' Observation" is also a "Check Airman Observation", though sometimes they are conducted jointly, in each case I've been involved with inspectors have stated who they are observing (qualifying PIC, check airman, or both) as part of their introduction.

727C47

It was weird ,when I upgraded on the 727 my first leg of IOE was the observed leg, with a way cool retired UAL 727 captain Fed in my jumpseat, nice guy, but I still had to fly the rest of IOE after that first trip, but the pressure was off : )

USMCFLYR

Where are you getting the bolded above out of his statement? He said:
Are you sure that you are quoting the right poster?

aviatorhi

Yes he did say that, and unless he misspoke at some point to me it sounds like initially it was a "pass / fail" event for the check airman, and later a "pass / fail" event for the student. I've been around plenty of these and can assure you that it is not "pass / fail" in the same sense of a traditional training event. As an above poster noted their observed leg was the first leg. A strong candidate may very well perform to required standards right out of the gate. The event need only be observed to an acceptable standard, and does not disqualify anybody if it is not up to standards.

As for the OP, as I said before, it's not even with worrying about.

USMCFLYR

You said:

Now you state:
I'll try to make it easy for me to understand here and quote PerfInit's three posts in this thread:
1.2.3.Now...with all of those quote above and your stated opinion that PerfInit somehow stated that this was a " "jeopardy" or "pass / fail" event" I simply ask you to point out (copy and paste the quote from above please or just use the numbers provided) where he said anything about it being pass/fail or a jepordy event.

You say you have been around these for some time and he has performed them for some time, so I'd think that you both understand them to some extent.
I wonder if you are reading into his post something that I don't see - or maybe I'm missing something - which is why I'm asking you to be specific.