Would You?
08-24-2014, 06:55 PM
#21
MK Ultra Candidate
Joined APC: Feb 2013
Position: Prime Leader of Boko Harumph
Posts: 1,167
08-24-2014, 07:00 PM
#22
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: FAA 'Flight Check'
Posts: 13,839
I'm not sure where anyone is getting that $30k/yr isn't a retirement.
You may not be able to live on it at the same level of comfort that the person currently enjoys - but that can be said for many retirements! It is certainly feasible that the retirement pays the mortgage and a car payment every month (depending on your tastes obviously!)
You may not be able to live on it at the same level of comfort that the person currently enjoys - but that can be said for many retirements! It is certainly feasible that the retirement pays the mortgage and a car payment every month (depending on your tastes obviously!)
08-24-2014, 07:11 PM
#23
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,011
I'm not sure where anyone is getting that $30k/yr isn't a retirement.
You may not be able to live on it at the same level of comfort that the person currently enjoys - but that can be said for many retirements! It is certainly feasible that the retirement pays the mortgage and a car payment every month (depending on your tastes obviously!)
You may not be able to live on it at the same level of comfort that the person currently enjoys - but that can be said for many retirements! It is certainly feasible that the retirement pays the mortgage and a car payment every month (depending on your tastes obviously!)
Then there is your 401k etc.. roll that into an annuity for guaranteed for life monthly payments.
08-24-2014, 07:14 PM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,011
I am a 46 y/o pilot making approximately 40K for a state govt. agency. In my job I primarily fly a single engine airplanes in VFR conditions and occasionally a Navajo. At this time, I'm vested and 15 years into a 25 year defined benefit retirement that will pay 75% of gross for life. The cons with this job are no raise in five years and no real promotional opportunities. Despite this, I'm feeling the need for new challenges in aviation.
Would you stay until 55 to complete the state retirement and hope for later opportunities or leave?
My stats -
Com Inst. AMEL, ATP Written
5000 total
600 ME PIC
200 ME Turbine PIC
Would you stay until 55 to complete the state retirement and hope for later opportunities or leave?
My stats -
Com Inst. AMEL, ATP Written
5000 total
600 ME PIC
200 ME Turbine PIC
What's scary about these kinds of government pension plans, whether it is local or state, there is the possibility of default still. You don't get to "own" the money in your account until it comes time to withdrawing it at retirement, that scares me.
Governments might want to control the distribution over time. Many companies allow (or require) you to withdraw the entire amount at retirement. I like that method better. I've always felt that if you don't hold it you don't own it.
08-24-2014, 10:30 PM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2005
Posts: 500
D5 Pilot-
Have you posted this question in any of the other sub forums? I would post this question in the fractional forum for sure. They will have great insight into that aspect of aviation. I flew for a regional airline when they were still called commuter airlines. It sucked, bad. My opinion, based on your age and the job you currently have, is to avoid the regional airlines at all cost. I was in my early 20's at the time so low wages, disrespect, terrible schedules and daily abuse weren't a big deal. I couldn't do it again now in my forties. The stories you hear about the regionals are not exaggerations. You don't need to go to prison to see first hand that it sucks when everyone can tell you it does.
Having said that I believe you are in a good position to pursue a corporate flying job whether it be for a fractional or otherwise. Since you aren't on the street you can be more selective about where you go. Getting hired at a corporate outfit is as much networking as it is about raw flight time. I understand the trepidation of leaving a pension but there's opportunity cost with staying at a low paying flying job (I mean no disrespect at all) when you could possibly double your salary, or more, in another sector of aviation while also growing professionally. 46 years old is not old. My friend's dad flew for NetJets until he was 75 (I know, I know).
I would continue to solicit opinions on this forum from all walks of aviation. I would also rule out the regional airlines as a viable option and focus elsewhere. And for your data points I am a major airline captain. Take into account everyone's point of view when distilling the info.
Just my $0.02!
Have you posted this question in any of the other sub forums? I would post this question in the fractional forum for sure. They will have great insight into that aspect of aviation. I flew for a regional airline when they were still called commuter airlines. It sucked, bad. My opinion, based on your age and the job you currently have, is to avoid the regional airlines at all cost. I was in my early 20's at the time so low wages, disrespect, terrible schedules and daily abuse weren't a big deal. I couldn't do it again now in my forties. The stories you hear about the regionals are not exaggerations. You don't need to go to prison to see first hand that it sucks when everyone can tell you it does.
Having said that I believe you are in a good position to pursue a corporate flying job whether it be for a fractional or otherwise. Since you aren't on the street you can be more selective about where you go. Getting hired at a corporate outfit is as much networking as it is about raw flight time. I understand the trepidation of leaving a pension but there's opportunity cost with staying at a low paying flying job (I mean no disrespect at all) when you could possibly double your salary, or more, in another sector of aviation while also growing professionally. 46 years old is not old. My friend's dad flew for NetJets until he was 75 (I know, I know).
I would continue to solicit opinions on this forum from all walks of aviation. I would also rule out the regional airlines as a viable option and focus elsewhere. And for your data points I am a major airline captain. Take into account everyone's point of view when distilling the info.
Just my $0.02!
08-24-2014, 11:26 PM
#26
Banned
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Position: Window Seat
Posts: 1,430
At some point you need to realize that at the end of the day it's all about QoL, that's something different to everybody (there is a big chunk though that just want the job at (insert major airline here)).
I would not leave a job with good QoL and stability to go take a WAG at something uncertain. Stay until you're 55 then go fly 135 somewhere and make yourself a nice nestegg for retirement.
I'm often asked the question about why I stay where I am and don't try to chase down a job at a major. Aside from not liking most company cultures out there it really comes down to QoL, having a schedule you like and the lifestyle you want is often worth many tens of thousands to people.
I would not leave a job with good QoL and stability to go take a WAG at something uncertain. Stay until you're 55 then go fly 135 somewhere and make yourself a nice nestegg for retirement.
I'm often asked the question about why I stay where I am and don't try to chase down a job at a major. Aside from not liking most company cultures out there it really comes down to QoL, having a schedule you like and the lifestyle you want is often worth many tens of thousands to people.
08-25-2014, 08:40 AM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Position: CRJ
Posts: 249
He makes $40K, but the actual value of his compensation is much higher than that due to the retirement and insurance, not to mention job security. What is that worth?
But, the OP is 46, and as another poster pointed out, if he got hired today at a regional, he'd be at least 3-5 years from being competitive at a major if all goes well--sooner if he really gets lucky. That makes him 50-52 years old minimum when he starts, giving him less than 15 years.
If it doesn't work that way, the alternative is he gets on with a regional, upgrades, and stays there, making decent money as an RJ captain. If he's lucky, that regional is around to the end of his career (19 more years). If he's not so lucky, that regional fades away or is merged.
D5Pilot, if I were you, I'd think this through pretty extensively. I think I'd stay where you are. If you retire at 55, you can still jump into a regional, probably with your government health insurance, and with that 3/4 pension you mentioned. You'll see captain on an RJ, and you might even get hired at a major for a couple of years. On the retirement alone, you need to do the math to figure out how much money you need to put away just to make up the money you will lose on your pension.
Further, I think if you wait, regional pay will go up. That's my opinion, but I could be wrong.
But, the OP is 46, and as another poster pointed out, if he got hired today at a regional, he'd be at least 3-5 years from being competitive at a major if all goes well--sooner if he really gets lucky. That makes him 50-52 years old minimum when he starts, giving him less than 15 years.
If it doesn't work that way, the alternative is he gets on with a regional, upgrades, and stays there, making decent money as an RJ captain. If he's lucky, that regional is around to the end of his career (19 more years). If he's not so lucky, that regional fades away or is merged.
D5Pilot, if I were you, I'd think this through pretty extensively. I think I'd stay where you are. If you retire at 55, you can still jump into a regional, probably with your government health insurance, and with that 3/4 pension you mentioned. You'll see captain on an RJ, and you might even get hired at a major for a couple of years. On the retirement alone, you need to do the math to figure out how much money you need to put away just to make up the money you will lose on your pension.
Further, I think if you wait, regional pay will go up. That's my opinion, but I could be wrong.
08-25-2014, 11:22 AM
#28
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 384
You have some options. Have you tried seeing if you could take a leave of absence from the gov to give the regionals a try? Most agencies allow it depending on staffing needs. I've worked both for the government and regionals. I found government work boring, but the stable income and benefits outweighed the desire to fly. I will admit that doing 121 flying is extremely fun. I just didn't enjoy the beat down from CS, customers and the company. Only you can decide which you prefer.
As someone who has worked both I'd say stay and finish up your retirement. You will have a wonderful extra income and medical coverage once you retire. Then if you want to drag a bag through the terminal you can. You will have plenty of time to do that even at 50 or 55 yrs old. Corporate, Bush, Tour flying are all viable options if the 121 world doesn't take you. Good luck in your decision.
As someone who has worked both I'd say stay and finish up your retirement. You will have a wonderful extra income and medical coverage once you retire. Then if you want to drag a bag through the terminal you can. You will have plenty of time to do that even at 50 or 55 yrs old. Corporate, Bush, Tour flying are all viable options if the 121 world doesn't take you. Good luck in your decision.
08-25-2014, 01:30 PM
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,011
You have some options. Have you tried seeing if you could take a leave of absence from the gov to give the regionals a try? Most agencies allow it depending on staffing needs. I've worked both for the government and regionals. I found government work boring, but the stable income and benefits outweighed the desire to fly. I will admit that doing 121 flying is extremely fun. I just didn't enjoy the beat down from CS, customers and the company. Only you can decide which you prefer.
As someone who has worked both I'd say stay and finish up your retirement. You will have a wonderful extra income and medical coverage once you retire. Then if you want to drag a bag through the terminal you can. You will have plenty of time to do that even at 50 or 55 yrs old. Corporate, Bush, Tour flying are all viable options if the 121 world doesn't take you. Good luck in your decision.
As someone who has worked both I'd say stay and finish up your retirement. You will have a wonderful extra income and medical coverage once you retire. Then if you want to drag a bag through the terminal you can. You will have plenty of time to do that even at 50 or 55 yrs old. Corporate, Bush, Tour flying are all viable options if the 121 world doesn't take you. Good luck in your decision.
08-25-2014, 01:37 PM
#30
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2009
Position: Square root of the variance and average of the variation
Posts: 1,602
D5 Pilot-
I was in my early 20's at the time so low wages, disrespect, terrible schedules and daily abuse weren't a big deal. I couldn't do it again now in my forties. The stories you hear about the regionals are not exaggerations. You don't need to go to prison to see first hand that it sucks when everyone can tell you it does.
I was in my early 20's at the time so low wages, disrespect, terrible schedules and daily abuse weren't a big deal. I couldn't do it again now in my forties. The stories you hear about the regionals are not exaggerations. You don't need to go to prison to see first hand that it sucks when everyone can tell you it does.
