Jarhead0352

Ok, so I have been reading the different posts about this same question and I am still confused. I am 36 and unemployed. I have always wanted to fly. Is it worth me even attempting to get into this field? Rotary or fixed wing? I am interested in both, but obviously I would want to choose the one with better career options. Also, what is a good school? I live in Vegas and have been considering moving to Orlando. Am I wasting my time? How much is total cost to get a license? Sorry for so many questions, but I am really confused on this. I would love any advice somebody can give me. Thanks!!!

rickair7777

First off, read this if you haven't already:

http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/fl...reer-read.html

About piloting...there are a very wide range of pilot jobs, from very crappy small-airplane jobs with crappy QOL, and pay less than $20K to very, very senior airline captain jobs which can pay $300K-ish with very good QOL.

At age 36 you will never reach the top, mandatory retirement is 65 (for airlines only , not for private commercial flying). The best you can hope for is to make a decent wage (maybe $100K) and have a decent QOL before all your hair turns grey.

RW training cost is higher, and it can be harder to get a job. Also the pay tops out lower than FW, maybe a little over $100K for the best jobs. But the good news is that there are not too many "dues paying" RW jobs, so your first job (after CFI) will probably pay enough for food and rent.

You will need an ATP license for an airline job. The realistic path to that (it requires 1500 hours) is to first get a commercial license and CFI ratings. This will mean 280-300 hours and cost $40-60K plus living expenses (you can spend a lot more, but that would be getting ripped off). Then work as a CFI to get 1500 hours (2-4 years), then apply to regional airlines.

After 1-8 years at a regional, you upgrade to Captain. After 1000-1500 hours as a captain (2-4 more years) you can reasonably expect to get a major airline job...hopefully you can stay with that airline for the rest of your career.

You will need living expense money during training. Also, due to very low pay you'll probably also need extra money during your employment as a CFI and your first year as a regional pilot.

In your shoes I would want at least $100-120K in cash to finance your entry into aviation (training and living expenses)...otherwise it will be painful or impossible. This assumes you are single with no debt, child support, or alimony. A dependent spouse and kids would make this impractical for you (on the flip side, a really understanding spouse with a really good job could subsidize your aviation career).

Assume that you'll need a 4-year college degree to get any decent aviation job unless you are very well connected (you aren't, or you wouldn't be asking these questions).

There is a theoretical possibility of a pilot shortage over the next 10-20 years...if that happens you could move up more quickly (the lower end of my estimate) and maybe get a major job without a degree.

Aviation is not going to be a solution for unemployment...you either need a good job to pay for flying, or a bunch of money. Also keep in mind that almost no flying jobs will have pensions...your retirement will be social security (which probably won't exist for you) and whatever you can save in a 401k.

Jarhead0352

Rickair7777,

Thank you for the advice. That's a lot to take in. I am going to read your site for some more info.

What about attempting to be a helicopter pilot? Any info on that? I have always been fascinated by both rotary and fixed wing. I really want to fly and would love to make it a career, but now I'm not sure if I can do it financially.

MiLa

I don't know about finding jobs, but I do know that helicopter training is significantly more expensive than fixed wing. I'm pretty sure there are a lot less jobs out there too. I met a guy who had put 100s of thousands of dollars into helo training and was working as a personal banker because he couldn't find a helo job.

Not trying to be negative and I'll be the first to admit that I'm no expert on helos but just what I've heard.

rickair7777

The path is similar to FW...pay for CPL and CFI, then work as a CFI. The challenge will be to get 1000 hours in turbine helos (many trainers are piston, ie R-22). Once you get your first turbine helo job, you should be in decent shape because they pay a living wage. With helos it's harder (and more costly) to break in, but once you get in the dues paying is over. Also seniority does not play as a large a factor in the helo world, so if you change jobs you don't start all over at starvation wages (like the airlines). This could work to your advantage since you wouldn't have to spend decades climbing airline seniority ladders.

Helo flying is inherently more dangerous than airlines...for many missions they fly low, over open water, and in bad weather at night in the case of EMS. Common jobs include oil platform support, executive transport, EMS, police (usually have to be a cop first), television, heavy lift, even crop dusting.

Financially the best path to flight training is to have a job, train part time and pay as you go. Getting loans (you pretty much need a job to get a loan nowdays) is a bad idea because you'll have a crushing debt load to go with your food-stamp wages (yes airline pilots are on food stamps...some airlines have specific written policies to prevent pilots from making a statement by applying for food stamps in uniform.)

Caelum Deus

Hey,
This is a great time to get into to flight training. In the next few years there will be a lot of jobs opening up. The pay is not the best in most cases, but eventually you can make a decent living as a pilot.
I would highly recommend my flight school (I know, of course I would say that). But we do have very low rates ($91 for the airplane and $55 for the CFI/HR), all of our CFIs are experienced professionals (meaning we're not just teaching to build time and move on), we have a lot of planes on line (so don't worry about the scheduling), and the school is located in SoCal (significantly less weather cancellations then training in other parts of the US).
That's my 2 cents, but I would recommend you look around first before making this type of investment. Just consider the above mentioned (rates, CFI experience, airplane availability, and yearly weather condition).

rickair7777

Entirely possible as long as the economy and oil prices do OK. But not a sure thing by any means.

Big Undestatement. The problem is it's not just the pay...it's the lack of stability, lack of benefits, and lack of retirement support. If you were making $200K+, you could deal with layoff's, buy your own insurance, and save for retirement. If you had good benefits and stability, you could deal with low pay and still be happy. But all of that combined means you'll never have a warm-fuzzy about your financial future.


If you get one of the remaining "good" airline jobs. Maybe 20-30% of pilots will get there, and the majority of those will be ex-military.

Caelum Deus

Wow, what a downer. Flyings not that bad. I'm not sure what caused you to have such a negative outlook on flying, but cheer up. You're a pilot. Instead of pushing this guy away from aviation, why don't you shine some light on the positive. We need more support in the aviation world, so having another pilot to contribute their motivation, financial support, and experience can only help the aviation industry.

Caelum Deus

Jarhead, get an opinion from someone who enjoys being a pilot. :-)

Rama

Don't go into rotary wing. Really, too few jobs out there. Go to an airport and count how many airplanes there are as opposed to helicopters