JordanNuytten

So guys im new to the forum, and Im not too sure im posting this in the right area but I need some advice. I am currently a PP with about 80TT and working on my multi. When i just turned 18 I was stupid and got into a bit of trouble, specifically possesion of marijuanna a speeding ticket (like 8 over) and a minor for alcohol. My whole life all I have wanted to do was fly for a major, except for this around 4 month span where I lost site of that. Is my record to the point where I will never get hired and I should persue something different or do I just need to work my hardest to be the best pilot I can be until im ready? Thanks!

proletariatav8r

Get a good attorney and research the process of getting your record expunged. You could possibly make a career flight instructing, get a job at an FBO and fly charter work in various cabin class aircraft, but as for 121 airline flying, if that drug possession is on your record, you will not be hired, or even looked at, no matter the job market. It's a non starter. No how-no way, without a legal expungment.

I'm sure somebody with a deeper leagel background could chime in too.

APC225

"do I just need to work my hardest to be the best pilot I can be until im ready"

Yes, you should do this anyway if this is your passion. But as proletariatav8r said, getting hired at a major is going to be difficult in normal circumstances. However, you can't predict the future. If there is ever a pilot shortage due to retirements, unexpected new laws, majors having to stop outsourcing for various reasons, you never know what could happen.

In the late 90s they were so short of pilots that more than one major was hiring well over 100 per month and if you walked in with an FAA license and medical, they'd put you in class the next day and ask questions later.

If you're going with hope, keep hoping. If you're playing the odds, have a backup plan. Maybe a little of both.

CaptCoolHand

This is not true, it is not a non starter. It will however be harder for you. Everyone makes mistakes. I would however follow the leagal advice above and work on getting it expunged, reduced, anything to make it less or go away.

Captain Jeff

Get your record as cleaned up as you can. No matter what career you chose that will be an important step. Getting a job at a major airline is a lot like an acting career. For it go well, you have to be in just the right place at the right time. There is no clear path that will get you to a job that pays 100,000. If you go an ask a Delta 777 captain about his job it is like asking Tom Cruise about acting. Those are the guys that "made it" not the hundreds guys who moved to Hollywood and turned into a waiter. Your record aside, you should consider a career with a higher chance of being one of those who "made it."

JordanNuytten

-Thanks guys, monday I will contact an expungment attorney and go from there. I think I will postpone my training till then however. Itll be hard though as I am now addicted to flying the seminole!

proletariatav8r

Step back and look at the fact that this is an airline forum, not a legal one, so take the advice concerning the legality of your problem with a grain of salt until you consult with an attorney who preferably specializes in said law.

The problem is not whether you can be hired, it’s can you pass the required DOT background check. If you mark “no” on an app, and it pings back a positive concerning a drug possession charge then your career with that airline quite obviously ends there. And now, unless you are that rare young person with all the requirements to be competitively hired at a 121 airline, AND you are debt free, now you are saddled with possibly vast student loans for a career that is unattainable.

The reason I have devoted so much time to your posting is that over the years, I personally have known pilots who have been arrested for bar fights while in college (that guy's a captain with a national airline), DUI’s (I know three different pilots who had got them), and plenty of speeding tickets (it’s been over ten years since I had a speeding ticket but in my younger days, I had a few). So I know active pilots who ran a little fast and loose in their high school days 20+ years ago and could have just as easily gotten caught with a dime sack on their person.

There is the public perception that we are all held to, of eagle scout honor and unassailable honesty, and for the most part it’s true. Just like with doctors. It’s even written into the requirements for the ATP, "of good moral character" right? But pilots are human beings too with flaws just like anybody. We just happen to think that we are better than average, and we are...at flying airplanes.

Laws reflect society’s mores. Such as Bankruptcy filings; When times are flush, courts take a much tougher stance than when times are bad. As for marijuana, I know pilots who smoked it years ago and who will be burning a fat bowl after their retirement party and everybody’s left home for the night. (That's about when their skullet will start to grow out too). But airline pilots and especially management, (and the DOT) take a zero tolerance policy regarding pot. And it will probably be that way for a few more generations. Sorry to hear about your troubles.

-Good luck.

Here’s a little definition I dug up;

In the common lawlegal system, an expungement proceeding is a type of lawsuit in which a first time offender of a prior criminal conviction seeks that the records of that earlier process be sealed, thereby making the records unavailable through the state or Federal repositories. If successful, the records are said to be "expunged". Black's Law Dictionary defines "expungement of record" as the "Process by which record of criminal conviction is destroyed or sealed from the state or Federal repository."[1] While expungement deals with an underlying criminal record, it is a civil action in which the subject is the petitioner or plaintiff asking a court to declare that the records be expunged.

A very real distinction exists between an expungement and a pardon. When an expungement is granted, the person whose record is expunged may, for most purposes, treat the event as if it never occurred. A pardon (also called “executive clemency”), on the other hand, does not “erase” the event. Rather, it constitutes forgiveness. In the United States, an expungement can be granted only by a judge, while a pardon can be granted only by a governor (for state law offenses) or the President (for federal offenses). In Nebraska pardons are by vote of the governor, attorney general and secretary of state.[2]

Each jurisdiction whose law allows expungement has its own definitions of expungement proceedings. Generally, expungement is the process to "remove from general review" the records pertaining to a case. In many jurisdictions, however, the records may not completely "disappear" and may still be available to law enforcement, to sentencing judges on subsequent offenses, and to corrections facilities to which the individual may be sentenced on subsequent convictions.[3]

Captain Jeff

BTW. If you have something expunged the crime is not visible anymore, but the fact that you had something expunged is visible to some people. I dont remember who can still see the expungment. A lawyer talked me out of expunging my "crime" since mine can be told in a funny way. For me, the expongement would look worse than the "crime". Be sure you ask/what can be seen after your done.

rickair7777

Not true. The one speeding ticket(non-reckless) and alcohol thing are minor and will not hurt if you keep a clean record.

The marijuana possession thing is more significant but at age 18 you have a lot of time to overcome that before applying to a major. The fact that you were very young will work in your favor as time passes, but you must maintain a spotless criminal record. Try to avoid traffic tickets too but if you get another one at some point it won't kill you.

DEFINITELY get the MJ thing expunged...you will still have to tell the airlines about it but one of their major concerns is public perception...they will not want the news media to be able to dig that up easily. I had a friend who got a job offer at a regional...they told him to go home and get his MJ possession expunged and only then call for a class date, true story.

The other big issue is your FAA medical...did you report the MJ conviction yet? You definitely have to report it on your next medical, and that might trigger a substance abuse review, which could be expensive and might result in a denied medical or suspension/revocation of your pilot certs. But I doubt they would pull your certs for one minor incident.

Your next hurdle will be a regional, by the time you apply to a major this will pretty much be water under the bridge. At the interview take FULL responsibility, don't blame it on your friend, girlfriend, cop or say something like "everybody does it".

Somebody mentioned the TSA list of disqualifying crimes for airport/SIDA access...I'm pretty sure that MJ possession is not on that list, but you can google it to be sure.

Just so we are clear...we are talking about possession, and nothing related to distribution? A drug dealing conviction would be an absolute permanent dis-qualifier for airlines.

Also an expungement, whatever the legal theory says, does NOT guarantee that nobody will ever see that event. If you lie about it when asked you are taking a big chance with the airlines, they have access to more information than normal civilian employers.

rcfd13

I wouldn't worry about the speeding tickets. Your driving record that airlines look at will only show tickets issued within the last 5 years. Eventually they'll go away as far as airlines are concerned. As others have stated, the marijuana conviction is what you probably have to worry about most. You should talk to a lawyer about that.