Debating becoming a regional lifer.
05-25-2017, 10:12 AM
#21
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jun 2014
Posts: 36
For me the most discouraging aspect of this hiring wave up to now is that they have seemed to favor young and less experienced over the late 30-early 40's who have been anxiously waiting for the lost decade to end and hiring to start. Seriously, through every setback over the last 17 years I and others have kept striving to move our career forward. Job fairs, consulting, prep, etc. Only to see thousands of people in their 20's get on the list ahead of us. It is what made me decide to stay where I am. They could have had me in 2014 or 2015, but now I just don't see the point. The best seniority numbers have already been claimed.
05-25-2017, 12:36 PM
#22
Layover Master
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Position: Seated
Posts: 4,323
For me the most discouraging aspect of this hiring wave up to now is that they have seemed to favor young and less experienced over the late 30-early 40's who have been anxiously waiting for the lost decade to end and hiring to start. Seriously, through every setback over the last 17 years I and others have kept striving to move our career forward. Job fairs, consulting, prep, etc. Only to see thousands of people in their 20's get on the list ahead of us. It is what made me decide to stay where I am. They could have had me in 2014 or 2015, but now I just don't see the point. The best seniority numbers have already been claimed.
05-25-2017, 12:46 PM
#23
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jun 2014
Posts: 36
I'm a senior Captain at an LCC. But the sentiment is the same. I was really trying for the Legacies for a while. How many has Delta hired since 2013? How many of those were under 40?
05-25-2017, 03:38 PM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2017
Position: 175 CA
Posts: 1,285
25 years is a long career man, for all we know mandatory retirement could be 75 by then.
05-25-2017, 04:51 PM
#26
Ich bin Pilot von Beruf
Joined APC: Aug 2016
Position: CRJ Kapitän
Posts: 615
All right, I am in a time crunch, but I do feel that I want to contribute to this thread. I want to help the OP. Sorry for grammar and spelling in advance--I'm crunched for time doing something else. Here are some ideas which I am pursuing to make myself more attractive to a legacy. It's not easy, but the reality is that we all have to make ourselves stand out; only hard work can get us where we wish to end up.
1. Obtain another type rating. Transition over to a different airframe if your airline's fleet possesses multiple types. If you're at Republic, this is impossible. Look for part 91 contract work. These gigs are out there, and they will type you if you seem to bear potential for their operation. Sign up for part time sim instructor work at CAE Simuflite or Flight Safety International--it will look good on your resume and they will also type you in whatever it is that you teach. Another option: go to Spirit, Frontier, Allegiant, Atlas or whoever else will type you in a bigger turbojet/fan aircraft. More long-term potential for earnings, 401k and Delta for example's sake has an obsession with pilots showing initiative to advance their careers.
2. Enroll in an online program to get a master's degree. I am doing one right now from FIT for $18k. They are time consuming, and some are aviation related, and will open the door for you with the FAA, NTSB as well as safety departments at your airline, giving you a headstart for a position with them which will likely make you very attractive to a legacy carrier.
3. Volunteer--do this as much as you can! It doesn't have to be every day, just do it two hours every two weeks if you must. Become involved with multiple programs. Seek out WAI, OBAP, NGPA for volunteer opportunities. Look for volunteer opportunities with ALPA. I just found out last week that UAL ALPA's headquarters are located five minutes away from where I live, and constantly seeking volunteers. Good opportunitity to volunteer, network and make the resume shine. I have been living where I am now for a year and feel stupid for not researching this earlier. EAA, AOPA and aviation universities are other ways for you to get involved with aviation groups in your community. You would be surprised how many EAA chapters are near you!
4. Keep checking off as many of those boxes as you can on airlineapps/pilot credentials. Get a seaplane rating, glider rating, CFI certificate and don't stop there. Check off every damn box to show them that you are not a stagnate pilot!
5. Acquire an official position with your company doing just about anything. Professional standards, union representative, safety department, hotel committee--it doesn't matter. Just do it!
6. Network! Go out where mainline pilots gather, talk to them, make connections, offer to become involved with whatever presents itself and have them refer you.
1. Obtain another type rating. Transition over to a different airframe if your airline's fleet possesses multiple types. If you're at Republic, this is impossible. Look for part 91 contract work. These gigs are out there, and they will type you if you seem to bear potential for their operation. Sign up for part time sim instructor work at CAE Simuflite or Flight Safety International--it will look good on your resume and they will also type you in whatever it is that you teach. Another option: go to Spirit, Frontier, Allegiant, Atlas or whoever else will type you in a bigger turbojet/fan aircraft. More long-term potential for earnings, 401k and Delta for example's sake has an obsession with pilots showing initiative to advance their careers.
2. Enroll in an online program to get a master's degree. I am doing one right now from FIT for $18k. They are time consuming, and some are aviation related, and will open the door for you with the FAA, NTSB as well as safety departments at your airline, giving you a headstart for a position with them which will likely make you very attractive to a legacy carrier.
3. Volunteer--do this as much as you can! It doesn't have to be every day, just do it two hours every two weeks if you must. Become involved with multiple programs. Seek out WAI, OBAP, NGPA for volunteer opportunities. Look for volunteer opportunities with ALPA. I just found out last week that UAL ALPA's headquarters are located five minutes away from where I live, and constantly seeking volunteers. Good opportunitity to volunteer, network and make the resume shine. I have been living where I am now for a year and feel stupid for not researching this earlier. EAA, AOPA and aviation universities are other ways for you to get involved with aviation groups in your community. You would be surprised how many EAA chapters are near you!
4. Keep checking off as many of those boxes as you can on airlineapps/pilot credentials. Get a seaplane rating, glider rating, CFI certificate and don't stop there. Check off every damn box to show them that you are not a stagnate pilot!
5. Acquire an official position with your company doing just about anything. Professional standards, union representative, safety department, hotel committee--it doesn't matter. Just do it!
6. Network! Go out where mainline pilots gather, talk to them, make connections, offer to become involved with whatever presents itself and have them refer you.
05-25-2017, 05:21 PM
#27
Layover Master
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Position: Seated
Posts: 4,323
Choose your own adventure. Stay your LCC if you are happy there.
05-25-2017, 07:03 PM
#28
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Posts: 153
All right, I am in a time crunch, but I do feel that I want to contribute to this thread. I want to help the OP. Sorry for grammar and spelling in advance--I'm crunched for time doing something else. Here are some ideas which I am pursuing to make myself more attractive to a legacy. It's not easy, but the reality is that we all have to make ourselves stand out; only hard work can get us where we wish to end up.
1. Obtain another type rating. Transition over to a different airframe if your airline's fleet possesses multiple types. If you're at Republic, this is impossible. Look for part 91 contract work. These gigs are out there, and they will type you if you seem to bear potential for their operation. Sign up for part time sim instructor work at CAE Simuflite or Flight Safety International--it will look good on your resume and they will also type you in whatever it is that you teach. Another option: go to Spirit, Frontier, Allegiant, Atlas or whoever else will type you in a bigger turbojet/fan aircraft. More long-term potential for earnings, 401k and Delta for example's sake has an obsession with pilots showing initiative to advance their careers.
2. Enroll in an online program to get a master's degree. I am doing one right now from FIT for $18k. They are time consuming, and some are aviation related, and will open the door for you with the FAA, NTSB as well as safety departments at your airline, giving you a headstart for a position with them which will likely make you very attractive to a legacy carrier.
3. Volunteer--do this as much as you can! It doesn't have to be every day, just do it two hours every two weeks if you must. Become involved with multiple programs. Seek out WAI, OBAP, NGPA for volunteer opportunities. Look for volunteer opportunities with ALPA. I just found out last week that UAL ALPA's headquarters are located five minutes away from where I live, and constantly seeking volunteers. Good opportunitity to volunteer, network and make the resume shine. I have been living where I am now for a year and feel stupid for not researching this earlier. EAA, AOPA and aviation universities are other ways for you to get involved with aviation groups in your community. You would be surprised how many EAA chapters are near you!
4. Keep checking off as many of those boxes as you can on airlineapps/pilot credentials. Get a seaplane rating, glider rating, CFI certificate and don't stop there. Check off every damn box to show them that you are not a stagnate pilot!
5. Acquire an official position with your company doing just about anything. Professional standards, union representative, safety department, hotel committee--it doesn't matter. Just do it!
6. Network! Go out where mainline pilots gather, talk to them, make connections, offer to become involved with whatever presents itself and have them refer you.
1. Obtain another type rating. Transition over to a different airframe if your airline's fleet possesses multiple types. If you're at Republic, this is impossible. Look for part 91 contract work. These gigs are out there, and they will type you if you seem to bear potential for their operation. Sign up for part time sim instructor work at CAE Simuflite or Flight Safety International--it will look good on your resume and they will also type you in whatever it is that you teach. Another option: go to Spirit, Frontier, Allegiant, Atlas or whoever else will type you in a bigger turbojet/fan aircraft. More long-term potential for earnings, 401k and Delta for example's sake has an obsession with pilots showing initiative to advance their careers.
2. Enroll in an online program to get a master's degree. I am doing one right now from FIT for $18k. They are time consuming, and some are aviation related, and will open the door for you with the FAA, NTSB as well as safety departments at your airline, giving you a headstart for a position with them which will likely make you very attractive to a legacy carrier.
3. Volunteer--do this as much as you can! It doesn't have to be every day, just do it two hours every two weeks if you must. Become involved with multiple programs. Seek out WAI, OBAP, NGPA for volunteer opportunities. Look for volunteer opportunities with ALPA. I just found out last week that UAL ALPA's headquarters are located five minutes away from where I live, and constantly seeking volunteers. Good opportunitity to volunteer, network and make the resume shine. I have been living where I am now for a year and feel stupid for not researching this earlier. EAA, AOPA and aviation universities are other ways for you to get involved with aviation groups in your community. You would be surprised how many EAA chapters are near you!
4. Keep checking off as many of those boxes as you can on airlineapps/pilot credentials. Get a seaplane rating, glider rating, CFI certificate and don't stop there. Check off every damn box to show them that you are not a stagnate pilot!
5. Acquire an official position with your company doing just about anything. Professional standards, union representative, safety department, hotel committee--it doesn't matter. Just do it!
6. Network! Go out where mainline pilots gather, talk to them, make connections, offer to become involved with whatever presents itself and have them refer you.
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05-28-2017, 05:15 PM
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: E170 CA
Posts: 200
All right, I am in a time crunch, but I do feel that I want to contribute to this thread. I want to help the OP. Sorry for grammar and spelling in advance--I'm crunched for time doing something else. Here are some ideas which I am pursuing to make myself more attractive to a legacy. It's not easy, but the reality is that we all have to make ourselves stand out; only hard work can get us where we wish to end up.
1. Obtain another type rating. Transition over to a different airframe if your airline's fleet possesses multiple types. If you're at Republic, this is impossible. Look for part 91 contract work. These gigs are out there, and they will type you if you seem to bear potential for their operation. Sign up for part time sim instructor work at CAE Simuflite or Flight Safety International--it will look good on your resume and they will also type you in whatever it is that you teach. Another option: go to Spirit, Frontier, Allegiant, Atlas or whoever else will type you in a bigger turbojet/fan aircraft. More long-term potential for earnings, 401k and Delta for example's sake has an obsession with pilots showing initiative to advance their careers.
2. Enroll in an online program to get a master's degree. I am doing one right now from FIT for $18k. They are time consuming, and some are aviation related, and will open the door for you with the FAA, NTSB as well as safety departments at your airline, giving you a headstart for a position with them which will likely make you very attractive to a legacy carrier.
3. Volunteer--do this as much as you can! It doesn't have to be every day, just do it two hours every two weeks if you must. Become involved with multiple programs. Seek out WAI, OBAP, NGPA for volunteer opportunities. Look for volunteer opportunities with ALPA. I just found out last week that UAL ALPA's headquarters are located five minutes away from where I live, and constantly seeking volunteers. Good opportunitity to volunteer, network and make the resume shine. I have been living where I am now for a year and feel stupid for not researching this earlier. EAA, AOPA and aviation universities are other ways for you to get involved with aviation groups in your community. You would be surprised how many EAA chapters are near you!
4. Keep checking off as many of those boxes as you can on airlineapps/pilot credentials. Get a seaplane rating, glider rating, CFI certificate and don't stop there. Check off every damn box to show them that you are not a stagnate pilot!
5. Acquire an official position with your company doing just about anything. Professional standards, union representative, safety department, hotel committee--it doesn't matter. Just do it!
6. Network! Go out where mainline pilots gather, talk to them, make connections, offer to become involved with whatever presents itself and have them refer you.
1. Obtain another type rating. Transition over to a different airframe if your airline's fleet possesses multiple types. If you're at Republic, this is impossible. Look for part 91 contract work. These gigs are out there, and they will type you if you seem to bear potential for their operation. Sign up for part time sim instructor work at CAE Simuflite or Flight Safety International--it will look good on your resume and they will also type you in whatever it is that you teach. Another option: go to Spirit, Frontier, Allegiant, Atlas or whoever else will type you in a bigger turbojet/fan aircraft. More long-term potential for earnings, 401k and Delta for example's sake has an obsession with pilots showing initiative to advance their careers.
2. Enroll in an online program to get a master's degree. I am doing one right now from FIT for $18k. They are time consuming, and some are aviation related, and will open the door for you with the FAA, NTSB as well as safety departments at your airline, giving you a headstart for a position with them which will likely make you very attractive to a legacy carrier.
3. Volunteer--do this as much as you can! It doesn't have to be every day, just do it two hours every two weeks if you must. Become involved with multiple programs. Seek out WAI, OBAP, NGPA for volunteer opportunities. Look for volunteer opportunities with ALPA. I just found out last week that UAL ALPA's headquarters are located five minutes away from where I live, and constantly seeking volunteers. Good opportunitity to volunteer, network and make the resume shine. I have been living where I am now for a year and feel stupid for not researching this earlier. EAA, AOPA and aviation universities are other ways for you to get involved with aviation groups in your community. You would be surprised how many EAA chapters are near you!
4. Keep checking off as many of those boxes as you can on airlineapps/pilot credentials. Get a seaplane rating, glider rating, CFI certificate and don't stop there. Check off every damn box to show them that you are not a stagnate pilot!
5. Acquire an official position with your company doing just about anything. Professional standards, union representative, safety department, hotel committee--it doesn't matter. Just do it!
6. Network! Go out where mainline pilots gather, talk to them, make connections, offer to become involved with whatever presents itself and have them refer you.
2. I have an MBA in airline mgmt...hasn't helped thus far.
3. Working on that...
4. I've put enough money into this career, and refuse to spend more. I have 7K hours of flying 4 or 5 legs a day into and out of the busiest airports in the country, for the very legacies I'm applying to. If that's not enough experience for them, well, I don't know what to tell them.
5. Working on it...
6. I have several internal recs at every legacy. Nothing has come from it. Sadly, it seems HR controls the process now...if you dont "score" well enough, you never get a call...it doesnt matter how well fellow pilots think of you. I despise this, but that's the way it is.
Sorry to be a bit fatalist...I do appreciate the advice. I think, sadly, the key is going to these job fairs. As much as I hate the game, it looks like playing it is the only way in.
05-28-2017, 06:00 PM
#30
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2015
Position: Gear slinger
Posts: 2,982
Sadly, it seems HR controls the process now...if you dont "score" well enough, you never get a call...it doesnt matter how well fellow pilots think of you. I despise this, but that's the way it is.
Sorry to be a bit fatalist...I do appreciate the advice. I think, sadly, the key is going to these job fairs. As much as I hate the game, it looks like playing it is the only way in.
Sorry to be a bit fatalist...I do appreciate the advice. I think, sadly, the key is going to these job fairs. As much as I hate the game, it looks like playing it is the only way in.
Perhaps your 10 years at a regional with little else added to the resume since has created the impression that you're complacent with your career (due to stagnation) to the HR matrix that pick and choose who gets called for interviews etc.
I have several friends who bit the bullet and went to U/LCCs and were called to legacies within 24 months of their arrival there. If you're absolutely hell bent on a legacy someday, theres always the AA WO regionals with flow agreements, but starting over the at bottom of a regional is probably less appealing than starting over at the bottom of a LCC.
You've got 29 years left before you retire... however with the pilot shortage your regional may not exist for anywhere near that long. You have to decide when its worth it to start at a company that is a career destination vs a contract carrier, and where you'll finish better financially if the legacy call never comes (and unfortunately there will be folks it never comes for). Going to a LCC that isn't your dream location is a gamble, however staying put at your regional maybe an even bigger gamble.
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