PIC time without an endorsement
08-14-2012, 08:21 AM
#1
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PIC time without an endorsement
If you have your private ASEL and are working on your commercial in an arrow and don't yet have your complex endorsement can you log that time as PIC? I didn't think so but somebody told me you could. I was wondering if anybody knew the reg that "says" you can.
08-14-2012, 08:27 AM
#2
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Yes you can. Category and class, ASEL.
Here is a link to a letter.
http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/...009/Herman.pdf
Here is a link to a letter.
http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/...009/Herman.pdf
08-15-2012, 06:13 AM
#3
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...and the reg is the good old Universal rule of logging time: 61.51: sole manipulator with applicable aircraft ratings = authority to log PIC time.
("Endorsements" are not "ratings." Ratings appear on your pilot certificate.)
("Endorsements" are not "ratings." Ratings appear on your pilot certificate.)
09-05-2012, 05:33 PM
#5
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I am glad that I stumbled on this thread. I am in sort of the same situation. I have ASEL comm but no HP endorsment and will start training on a Turbo Prop single soon. I know that I need the endorsment before taking the plane alone but didn't know I could log PIC while doing training. Now it isn't as big of emergency to get the endorsment as it was a minute ago.
09-05-2012, 05:56 PM
#6
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Similar question for you guys. Does a type rating in a high altitude aircraft (Jet) qualify you for the high altitude endorsement on a smaller aircraft that would otherwise require a high altitude endorsement (ie- C421). I'm a bit concerned, because "technically" I don't have a high altitude endorsement.
09-06-2012, 01:55 AM
#7
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61.31(g) applies to all aircraft that can operate above 25,000 feet, 421 to 747. So if you got a jet type through an airline's training department buried in your training records would be sections on high altitude ops. The reg says you need the endorsement in your logbook or your training records.
09-06-2012, 09:27 AM
#8
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61.31(g) applies to all aircraft that can operate above 25,000 feet, 421 to 747. So if you got a jet type through an airline's training department buried in your training records would be sections on high altitude ops. The reg says you need the endorsement in your logbook or your training records.
True, but a real tool fed might want you to produce said 121 records and most of us don't have those. This might be an issue if you don't have a high-alt type on your cert. You would prevail in the end but it might be a hassle if you don't have a copy of that training record in your own files.
Also, I'm pretty sure that an SIC type does not satisfy the high-alt requirement since that has PIC-specific language. You might not have part 91 high-alt PIC privileges based on 121 SIC training/experience...you would need a PIC type.
10-02-2012, 08:28 PM
#9
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The one thing I need in order to log PIC is to have proper category (Airplane) and Class (Single Engine) even if I don't have the necessary endorsement to be the Sole manipulator? So technically I can log turboprop as PIC even if I don't have a high performance or high altitude endorsements? Can I just log it as SIC just to be safe? Also, lets say someone lost their medical they can't be PIC correct, so can they log time at all then? Sorry for asking a lot of questions.
10-27-2012, 05:58 AM
#10
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Position: B-757/767 Capt.
Posts: 120
You guys are gonna love this one...I'm a captain on the 757/767 with types in the 727 and C-500 and Lear Jet. I have lots of thousands of hours PIC in those types, except the Citation, and I go to get checked out in a Piper Lance and guess what? I need a high performance endorsement because they said without a prop those airplanes didn't meet the definition of "high performance". I say, you're kidding, right? Nope. So now I have a High Performance Endorsement. I still think that "expert" is full of **** but I played along.
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