zerozero

Thanks!
Looking forward to seeing you there.

LRSRanger

Sweet! Hope to see some of you there!


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CallmeJB

Do CX or NCA ever fly contracts for other companies? Do they ever fly charter trips on another airline's routes?

The answer to both questions is yes.

This isn't about who flies what, it's about how much pilots get paid and how well we're treated. A rising tide raises all boats.

Do you wish for Atlas pilots to make less? If Atlas pilots made less, how do you think that would affect the flying with NCA? Would Atlas be likely to do more NCA flying or less NCA flying?

CandlerKid

Ironic that a contract pilot at NCA is complaining about his/her flying being taken away... Atlas has a whopping 1 plane out of 100 flying for NCA. The vast majority are flying for DHL. The future growth of 20+ 767's flying domestic for Amazon is what this is about. Don't you want the 767 rates at Atlas to be raised? Southern (owned by Atlas) flies 737's at rates much lower than yours. We are trying to raise that to above yours to raise the bar for all pilots. Thank you to all who help us out!

Braniff DC8

My point is that although CX is NOT on strike they too are in a work slowdown for the same reason you guys/gals at Atlas are, mostly schedules though. Tons are fed up and have quit, like Atlas pilot's as there is simply no longer a reason to stay. While this is all going on Atlas aircraft, flown by Atlas pilots, are flying CX cargo. Rising all boats would require all of the pilots to work together. The NCA things is just simply outsourcing. My "BOYFRIEND" as a simple minded blithering idiot wrote elsewhere, has decided to, in fact, leave NCA as again, there is no longer a reason to stay.

I get your fight but be aware of what you are doing while to accomplish that task. Put the shoe on the other foot and Atlas does go on strike. Would you like the CX pilot's flying your work or not? CX still has some freighter orders and could get that Amazon flying tomorrow. Doubt it will happen. My point is I do not think you will get any sympathy from CX guys/gals now.

Just to be clear, I am NOT trying to pick a fight. I am making you aware of what is currently going on.

CandlerKid

Fyi we don't have any long term contract in place with Cathay. That's all a rumor. We have one plane flying a 2 month contract over peak is what I was told. Not using their call sign.

Atrasaty

Bottom line here is that ACMI as a business model has been around for a long time and will be around for the foreseeable future. If the pilots of the aforementioned ACMI carriers can force the various players to provide them with a contract comparable to the other major airlines then the financial incentives to outsource diminish. DHL and Amazon will have to compete on a more level field with Fedex and UPS. Cathay, Emirates, Etihad, NCA etc etc etc will have to evaluate the benefit of outsourcing and it may end up that the only reason to do so is crewing verses cost. I'm fine with that.

zerozero

I appreciate your support, BUT! I actually disagree with your conclusion.

Improving ACMI terms and conditions is a mere drop in the bucket compared to the revenue generated per employee at an organization like Atlas.

Look, Atlas has about 2000 employees TOTAL. Of those, ~1400 are pilots. Atlas employs NO flight attendants (contractors), few mechanics, no ticket agents, and virtually NO physical infrastructure. Atlas doesn't even pay for FUEL, the customers do!

This is where the TRUE efficiencies come from that make Atlas an attractive outsourcing operation.

FedEx, UPS, Cathay, etc ALL suffer from higher overhead costs.

So, in point of fact, improving crew members' compensation and working conditions so that these organizations can continue to attract and RETAIN talent in order to absorb more business opportunities (like Amazon--ARE YOU READING THIS BILL FLYNN?) means we ALL make more money.

Atrasaty

Not sure I'm following your logic....but its probably my deficiency. The way I see it is that operating an airline is mostly comprised of fixed costs that do not vary much between airlines. Fuel costs what the market says it costs. Aircraft leases cost what they cost. Landing and gate fees are what they are. Small percentage margins are the difference between profit or huge profit in a multi billion dollar entity. The Harvard MBA muppets running most airlines these days will seek that wafer thin margin where ever they can theoretically find it and the easy Pavlovian solution for them is labor. They perceive that cost to be variable and the unquantifiable and thus worthless good will and morale be damned. ACMI as a stop gap, supplement or a means to get an operation up and running is one thing. What DHL and Amazon are doing is wholly different. Flynn and his funkies will tell you that we can't pay you and be competitive. If you want my commitment to your brand then pay me, don't threaten me. If we all are paid appropriately then that variable is removed and ACMI is a threat to no one which takes me back to my original point. If you dislike ACMI then you should really wish us sucess in our endeavor, it reduces those margins and makes us less likely to appear on your doorstep.

zerozero

Right!

I think you and I basically agree, except I don't believe this part. This is just a "ruse" to confuse and divide us.

Problem is: a lot of our crews believe it.