Southern Air Interview
10-27-2015, 08:10 PM
#651
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2015
Position: Captain
Posts: 132
Would be ready but think I'll stay home anyway for now. Financial impact of a new job then financial impact of labor issues. Too much risk.
10-27-2015, 08:11 PM
#652
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2015
Position: Captain
Posts: 132
Pay is still 737- $60.61
777-$61.72
first year FO.
$2.00 per diem -737
$2.50 per diem -777
737 Schedules are still the same roughly except cities serviced. Dropped YEG, MKE, YWG. Added SLC, DEN, MHR, JFK, and RNO. Line values are still 35-55hours.
The planned 737 air frame #6 and #7 has been further delayed until next year. I think due to sourcing "good" air frames.
777 schedules starting to show blending again with LAX and the two main trips out of CVG. Line values average 70 hours or so with max being 106 and least being 37hours. Many the last few months have not been breaking guarantee due to removed flying. Now that the 5th 777 is online, that will hopefully change. 777 appears overstaffed still. The rumored 6th and 7th 777 may not happen as DHL doesn't want to lease air frames and LANTAM doesn't want to sell them.
Next 777 class in Nov. Next 737 class Oct and Jan.
737 commuting I have heard is difficult. Southern has limited jumpseat agreements and CVG has shrunk quite a bit and has limited flights. I'm unsure of any crashpads.
Steve Briner from GoJets will be joining Soaper and the SOO MGMT team. I don't think much good will come of this duo.
Attrition at SOO is at 50% for the year. Mgmt so far has responded with an "exit interview" as a fix.
777-$61.72
first year FO.
$2.00 per diem -737
$2.50 per diem -777
737 Schedules are still the same roughly except cities serviced. Dropped YEG, MKE, YWG. Added SLC, DEN, MHR, JFK, and RNO. Line values are still 35-55hours.
The planned 737 air frame #6 and #7 has been further delayed until next year. I think due to sourcing "good" air frames.
777 schedules starting to show blending again with LAX and the two main trips out of CVG. Line values average 70 hours or so with max being 106 and least being 37hours. Many the last few months have not been breaking guarantee due to removed flying. Now that the 5th 777 is online, that will hopefully change. 777 appears overstaffed still. The rumored 6th and 7th 777 may not happen as DHL doesn't want to lease air frames and LANTAM doesn't want to sell them.
Next 777 class in Nov. Next 737 class Oct and Jan.
737 commuting I have heard is difficult. Southern has limited jumpseat agreements and CVG has shrunk quite a bit and has limited flights. I'm unsure of any crashpads.
Steve Briner from GoJets will be joining Soaper and the SOO MGMT team. I don't think much good will come of this duo.
Attrition at SOO is at 50% for the year. Mgmt so far has responded with an "exit interview" as a fix.
10-28-2015, 05:38 AM
#653
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: 777, sofa
Posts: 1,183
Two more bits of current information to add.
1)The training pipeline seems to be backed up again, at least on the guppy fleet. Expect to sit at home about two months on training pay after your type ride before heading out to IOE. Budget accordingly. Also, benefit costs have gone up again for 2016.
2) If Connie goes out on strike, I imagine given the language below that you won't get paid while honoring the picket line. At least until the grievance is settled.
Section 21
"A. Picket Lines
It shall not be cause for discipline or discharge if a Crewmember refuses to enter upon any property involved in a primary labor dispute with the IBT or its affiliated Local Unions, or refuses to cross or work behind any primary picket line of the IBT or its affiliated Local Unions, or refuses to deadhead on a struck carrier or layover at a struck hotel."
1)The training pipeline seems to be backed up again, at least on the guppy fleet. Expect to sit at home about two months on training pay after your type ride before heading out to IOE. Budget accordingly. Also, benefit costs have gone up again for 2016.
2) If Connie goes out on strike, I imagine given the language below that you won't get paid while honoring the picket line. At least until the grievance is settled.
Section 21
"A. Picket Lines
It shall not be cause for discipline or discharge if a Crewmember refuses to enter upon any property involved in a primary labor dispute with the IBT or its affiliated Local Unions, or refuses to cross or work behind any primary picket line of the IBT or its affiliated Local Unions, or refuses to deadhead on a struck carrier or layover at a struck hotel."
10-28-2015, 06:11 AM
#654
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2014
Posts: 264
robthree,
So how's it going on the other side of the house? Miss the Triple?
To all others FYI, management shakeups will probably continue, none of which are positive or an improvement.
Attrition rate is currently running at about close to 50%. The flight crews number around 230+, and has not really moved off that level due to the heavy attrition. Constant training to replace those leaving means that your not going to quickly build time and leave. Your going to sit at home either waiting for training or getting displaced for training.
The only people that are making money are the check airman that are picking up extra flying. Many of them are timing out.
As robthree has stated union issues are looming large, both in support of the Teamsters and for SAI contract negotiations. So if your not ready to support that, it would be best to stay away.
SAI is adapting new Flag & Domestic rest/duty rules. I can assure you that it only benefits the company and not the crews. It means working harder and making less.
Really surprised at the length of this thread. Would think that it would be abandoned by now, seeing how the conditions at SAI are pretty terrible and only getting worse.
So how's it going on the other side of the house? Miss the Triple?
To all others FYI, management shakeups will probably continue, none of which are positive or an improvement.
Attrition rate is currently running at about close to 50%. The flight crews number around 230+, and has not really moved off that level due to the heavy attrition. Constant training to replace those leaving means that your not going to quickly build time and leave. Your going to sit at home either waiting for training or getting displaced for training.
The only people that are making money are the check airman that are picking up extra flying. Many of them are timing out.
As robthree has stated union issues are looming large, both in support of the Teamsters and for SAI contract negotiations. So if your not ready to support that, it would be best to stay away.
SAI is adapting new Flag & Domestic rest/duty rules. I can assure you that it only benefits the company and not the crews. It means working harder and making less.
Really surprised at the length of this thread. Would think that it would be abandoned by now, seeing how the conditions at SAI are pretty terrible and only getting worse.
10-28-2015, 12:39 PM
#655
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: 777, sofa
Posts: 1,183
10-29-2015, 11:56 PM
#656
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2005
Position: Under the Frog
Posts: 1,125
Congrats on the escape! You're gonna love it!
11-17-2015, 09:42 PM
#657
New Hire
Joined APC: Nov 2015
Position: Lear
Posts: 3
So I've spent all day/night reading every single post on this thread on Southern...needless to say its a rough read. I recently interviewed with them last Friday and was offered a 777 class date this upcoming January.
Im not from CVG, and I do not have any desire for the 737. So my main question is being very junior on a very senior airplane how often can I expect to do these "50 day deployments" rather than just do my 20 and go home? With current hiring how quickly will I be able to sit reserve at home?
Its pretty obvious this is a stepping stone, but not much is mentioned about where 777 FO's end up going once they have decided their time at Southern needs to come to an end. Do a majority just go to another ACMI?
Im not from CVG, and I do not have any desire for the 737. So my main question is being very junior on a very senior airplane how often can I expect to do these "50 day deployments" rather than just do my 20 and go home? With current hiring how quickly will I be able to sit reserve at home?
Its pretty obvious this is a stepping stone, but not much is mentioned about where 777 FO's end up going once they have decided their time at Southern needs to come to an end. Do a majority just go to another ACMI?
11-18-2015, 03:53 AM
#658
On Reserve
Joined APC: Aug 2013
Posts: 19
So I've spent all day/night reading every single post on this thread on Southern...needless to say its a rough read. I recently interviewed with them last Friday and was offered a 777 class date this upcoming January.
Im not from CVG, and I do not have any desire for the 737. So my main question is being very junior on a very senior airplane how often can I expect to do these "50 day deployments" rather than just do my 20 and go home? With current hiring how quickly will I be able to sit reserve at home?
Its pretty obvious this is a stepping stone, but not much is mentioned about where 777 FO's end up going once they have decided their time at Southern needs to come to an end. Do a majority just go to another ACMI?
Im not from CVG, and I do not have any desire for the 737. So my main question is being very junior on a very senior airplane how often can I expect to do these "50 day deployments" rather than just do my 20 and go home? With current hiring how quickly will I be able to sit reserve at home?
Its pretty obvious this is a stepping stone, but not much is mentioned about where 777 FO's end up going once they have decided their time at Southern needs to come to an end. Do a majority just go to another ACMI?
This is simply one pilots opinion, whose been flying Part 121 since 2004, so please take it with a grain of salt.
I know many on this board refuse to accept that there is an actual pilot shortage, and I don't blame them. I've been hearing about a pilot shortage since I was in high school and made early career decisions based on getting a seniority number as early as possible at a legacy carrier that now I regret. I think in actuality however, the numbers are hard to argue with barring some insane paradigm shift like we saw in 911, but even then all the airlines were at the edge of a cliff financially and 911 just pushed them over an exposed the cracks.
That being said, I personally would not take any stepping stone position and work my ass of to get hired directly at the airline (hmm hmm) I see myself staying at for the rest of my career. If you are currently logging 121 time, regardless of whether its PIC a legacy carrier will pick you up in the next few years, if that is what your goal is I would stick to that. If you are in a position where you need to get out of your current situation at least try to go to Atlas for a stepping stone.
Regarding Southern, pilot attrition will eventually lead to the companies demise, probably sooner than later. There are simply not enough normal functioning people that are willing to work 20 days a month for crap wages. Why would anyone go work for Southern when Atlas can barely hold on to its pilots and is also planning on doubling its crew force in the next few years. I'm not saying Atlas is a bowl of cherries, but it is objectively a much better job than Southern Air, and at their current attrition rate and need to grow the crew force they will soon be looking for anyone who can dress themselves. At Atlas the same questions get asked, why would you stay at Atlas if United, DAL, FedEx etc. call them? However, for many, Atlas is a smart strategy for laying up because if you never get those calls, its probably a company that will be around for the next 20 years, they are making insane amounts of money and have and have massive growth plans that they are currently not sharing. Last quarter they paid of 4 747-400s and bought back 20 mil in stock.
All this has been mentioned in a previous thread:
http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/ca...tcy-again.html
I personally think we are running around playing a game of musical Chairs between Kaltia, Atlas, Southern Air and a few other cargo carriers. When the music stops a few of those companies aren't going to have chairs, and I personally wouldn't want to be at Southern Air when that happens.
Again these are just my opinions and I am not anyones career fiduciary, so again don't take anything I say as fact, do your own research. Best of luck in your career decision. If you do take the job at Southern Air, I'm sure you will enjoy it because there are some great people working there.
11-18-2015, 04:44 AM
#659
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2011
Posts: 135
Seems pilots have been offered 777 classes in the last round of interviews. Anyone been offered the 737? I only ask because I interviewed 2 weeks ago and haven't heard anything from them at all.
Does Southern not even send a rejection email?
Does Southern not even send a rejection email?
11-18-2015, 07:12 AM
#660
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: 777, sofa
Posts: 1,183
Lear,
One plus as a new hire at Southern is that your lack of seniority is pretty meaningless. All the lines are 20 on / 10 off. It never gets any better. You will probably do the same trips as the most senior FOs. You may be at work on Christmas and Thanksgiving, but so will most of the crews.
The company does not want to pay you trip extension pay, so you will rarely be forced into back-to-back rotations. It will be more common that you do it to yourself chasing specific days off.
777 FOs are escaping pretty much everywhere these days. A couple of us have made it to United, American, and Spirit. Atlas is a pay raise for any FO with less than 6 years seniority. 737 guys are going to WN and AK pretty regularly. Not to mention all the guys who jumped to WGA. There are not many places lower down on the food chain than Southern.
One plus as a new hire at Southern is that your lack of seniority is pretty meaningless. All the lines are 20 on / 10 off. It never gets any better. You will probably do the same trips as the most senior FOs. You may be at work on Christmas and Thanksgiving, but so will most of the crews.
The company does not want to pay you trip extension pay, so you will rarely be forced into back-to-back rotations. It will be more common that you do it to yourself chasing specific days off.
777 FOs are escaping pretty much everywhere these days. A couple of us have made it to United, American, and Spirit. Atlas is a pay raise for any FO with less than 6 years seniority. 737 guys are going to WN and AK pretty regularly. Not to mention all the guys who jumped to WGA. There are not many places lower down on the food chain than Southern.
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