Nic ...
09-30-2014, 07:07 AM
#674
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2014
Posts: 147
Cacti won't acknowledge it. Here ya go. If the east had been staffed like the west we would have had about 300 more pilots. Curiously, about the number recalled by the time Nic came out with his list.
From the Nicolau opinion and award. Available to anyone at cactuspilot.com for those that don't believe me.
"As of the merger date, there were also differences in staffing,
differences that remain. As of January 1, 2007, the aircraft and staffing
figures were:
US Airways America West
Equip. AIC Staffing Equip. AIC Staffing
A330 9 23.11 NA NA NA
B767 10 21.50 NA NA NA
B757 34 10.09 B757 12 14.75
A320 102 10.70 A320 94 12.32
B737 69 9.01 B737 27 12.07
EMB 2 19.50"
From the Nicolau opinion and award. Available to anyone at cactuspilot.com for those that don't believe me.
"As of the merger date, there were also differences in staffing,
differences that remain. As of January 1, 2007, the aircraft and staffing
figures were:
US Airways America West
Equip. AIC Staffing Equip. AIC Staffing
A330 9 23.11 NA NA NA
B767 10 21.50 NA NA NA
B757 34 10.09 B757 12 14.75
A320 102 10.70 A320 94 12.32
B737 69 9.01 B737 27 12.07
EMB 2 19.50"
On May 19, 2005, US Airways and America West Airlines
announced that they would merge, taking the name US Airways. Both
pilot groups were represented by the Air Line Pilots Association, which
has a Merger Policy governing the integration of pilot seniority lists.There were also differences in the financial condition of the two
carriers. For a short time, America West had been in bankruptcy but
emerged in 1994 as a low cost carrier (LCC) operating out of hubs in
Phoenix and Las Vegas. US Airways had also declared bankruptcy, not
once but twice. And it was still in bankruptcy at the time of the merger
and was unprepared to present a reorganization plan for its emergence.
Despite these differences, to be detailed later, it is clear from the
evidence that the more financially able needed the other and that both
have benefited financially from the acquisition.US Airways
At the time of the US Air/America West merger, US Airways had a grand total of 5098 pilots on its seniority list, 1691 of which (33%) were on furlough.
America West
As of the merger, it had 1894 pilots on its
list. All, however, were active and less than 200 had spent time onfurlough and then for relatively short periods during the early and mid-90s, at which point hiring resumed with 1131 additional pilots added to the list.
The Conclusion
As evidenced by Captain Brucia's Concurring and Dissenting
Opinion, attached hereto, he disagrees with this aspect of the Award.
His view is that at a minimum consideration should be given to those
US Airways pilots already recalled; that treatment of them as active
pilots consistent with their present status would serve to recognize
the substantial time they had already invested in their airline. In the
majority's view, this gives weight to post-merger expectations rather
than pre-merger expectations, contrary to what ALPA policy foresees.
In so doing it fails to recognize the prospects the US Airways pilots
faced before the merger; including the reduction of the active pilot
work force from 5500 to close to 3000, the sharp reduction in the size
of the fleet since the 1990's; the absence of recalls though many
active pilots were retiring; the successive bankruptcies and the
inability to successfully emerge from that condition. When all that is
considered, in the majority's view, it is far more appropriate to
combine those who brought jobs to the merger, particularly when the
protection of career expectations is of such overriding concern. This is
not to say, of course, that this merger is designed or should be
thought of as a model for others that may follow. As stated at the
beginning, each case does turn on its own facts. As a consequence,
different facts may produce different results. Here, a majority is of the
opinion that the facts of this case justify our conclusion.
09-30-2014, 08:37 AM
#675
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2011
Position: A320 Capt
Posts: 5,299
The award is the place to go to fact check. The boss has some bad numbers. Some other facts and the bottom line from a very long document:
US Airways
On May 19, 2005, US Airways and America West Airlines
announced that they would merge, taking the name US Airways. Both
pilot groups were represented by the Air Line Pilots Association, which
has a Merger Policy governing the integration of pilot seniority lists.There were also differences in the financial condition of the two
carriers. For a short time, America West had been in bankruptcy but
emerged in 1994 as a low cost carrier (LCC) operating out of hubs in
Phoenix and Las Vegas. US Airways had also declared bankruptcy, not
once but twice. And it was still in bankruptcy at the time of the merger
and was unprepared to present a reorganization plan for its emergence.
Despite these differences, to be detailed later, it is clear from the
evidence that the more financially able needed the other and that both
have benefited financially from the acquisition.US Airways
At the time of the US Air/America West merger, US Airways had a grand total of 5098 pilots on its seniority list, 1691 of which (33%) were on furlough.
America West
As of the merger, it had 1894 pilots on its
list. All, however, were active and less than 200 had spent time onfurlough and then for relatively short periods during the early and mid-90s, at which point hiring resumed with 1131 additional pilots added to the list.
The Conclusion
As evidenced by Captain Brucia's Concurring and Dissenting
Opinion, attached hereto, he disagrees with this aspect of the Award.
His view is that at a minimum consideration should be given to those
US Airways pilots already recalled; that treatment of them as active
pilots consistent with their present status would serve to recognize
the substantial time they had already invested in their airline. In the
majority's view, this gives weight to post-merger expectations rather
than pre-merger expectations, contrary to what ALPA policy foresees.
In so doing it fails to recognize the prospects the US Airways pilots
faced before the merger; including the reduction of the active pilot
work force from 5500 to close to 3000, the sharp reduction in the size
of the fleet since the 1990's; the absence of recalls though many
active pilots were retiring; the successive bankruptcies and the
inability to successfully emerge from that condition. When all that is
considered, in the majority's view, it is far more appropriate to
combine those who brought jobs to the merger, particularly when the
protection of career expectations is of such overriding concern. This is
not to say, of course, that this merger is designed or should be
thought of as a model for others that may follow. As stated at the
beginning, each case does turn on its own facts. As a consequence,
different facts may produce different results. Here, a majority is of the
opinion that the facts of this case justify our conclusion.
Looking at that, we have about 8% more line pilots today than we did the day the merger was announced. That while flying about 50 fewer hulls. I believe the difference is proper staffing, more IROs on the 330s, and training float.
The last paragraph you quoted is one of the mysteries to me about Nicolau. By the time he issued his award, that had already been proven incorrect. We recalled 300 pilots while shedding 50 hulls.
09-30-2014, 10:57 AM
#676
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2014
Posts: 147
In defense of cacti(I know, it surprises me too), there is a bit of apples and oranges going on. What is "active"? If you notice in the above Nicolau doesn't use the word active for US pilots, he gives the total and furloughed. For AWA pilots, he says that they were all active. So I have to come to the conclusion that by "active" he means just not furloughed, as AWA had guys out on medical, MIL, etc. But we have a different definition of active because those out on medical, LOA, MIL and management are not active line pilots. If you are looking at total numbers of a seniority list it's hard to get an idea of the butts in the seat without going through the whole list. The east has a lot of medicals. But using the bid gives a pretty clear indication of what is available to the line pilot. I would imagine that we also carry a larger number of management and training pilots.
Looking at that, we have about 8% more line pilots today than we did the day the merger was announced. That while flying about 50 fewer hulls. I believe the difference is proper staffing, more IROs on the 330s, and training float.
The last paragraph you quoted is one of the mysteries to me about Nicolau. By the time he issued his award, that had already been proven incorrect. We recalled 300 pilots while shedding 50 hulls.
Looking at that, we have about 8% more line pilots today than we did the day the merger was announced. That while flying about 50 fewer hulls. I believe the difference is proper staffing, more IROs on the 330s, and training float.
The last paragraph you quoted is one of the mysteries to me about Nicolau. By the time he issued his award, that had already been proven incorrect. We recalled 300 pilots while shedding 50 hulls.
09-30-2014, 11:05 AM
#677
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2011
Position: A320 Capt
Posts: 5,299
The numbers did not look right and you can't argue with the bid Drizzle posted. Between that and the info in the award, it's the facts that back your argument or any one else for that matter. The who's "active" only complicates what is already very complicated. A lot to sort out.
The difference is, I was on that side and living it, cacti wasn't.
10-02-2014, 04:09 PM
#679
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,967
10-02-2014, 05:59 PM
#680
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2008
Posts: 440
And if you judge the SLI Arbitration Panel's award less than "fair and equitable"...how shall you proceed?
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