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Old 04-30-2013, 03:05 PM
  #811  
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Originally Posted by cactiboss
So usapa lied to the west that the Nic. would not go away if we voted for the mou?
Exactly when and where did USAPA promise that the MOU preserves the Nic.?
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Old 04-30-2013, 03:21 PM
  #812  
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Originally Posted by ackattacker
Exactly when and where did USAPA promise that the MOU preserves the Nic.?
where did they say it would be doh? Usapa made it very clear that the mou was seniority "neutral" didn't they?
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Old 04-30-2013, 03:24 PM
  #813  
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Originally Posted by ackattacker
No, I saw that part. I'm not sure why you are referencing it, but I'll take a wild guess that you think it means something important beyond what it actually says. What it says is rather obvious... that USAPA's position on seniority integration has the potential to affect the West pilot group "one way or the other". (i.e. positively or negatively). About the most neutral and obvious thing someone could possibly say about the situation.

It does NOT say that USAPA's position on seniority integration is an automatic breach of DFR, which appears to be what you are implying.
I forgot to add this part:
That is true even if the West Pilots are allowed to advocate for the Nicolau Award seniority list, because the US Airways’ pilots would still be asserting two conflicting positions.
This is where they kill the easts 3 way "fantasy"
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Old 04-30-2013, 04:04 PM
  #814  
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Originally Posted by cactiboss
I forgot to add this part:
This is where they kill the easts 3 way "fantasy"[/COLOR]
Our opinion, AOL's opinion, and the Co. opinion matter little. Case law and legal precedent rule..
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Old 04-30-2013, 04:08 PM
  #815  
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Originally Posted by LittleBoyBlew
Our opinion, AOL's opinion, and the Co. opinion matter little. Case law and legal precedent rule..
Case Law says that changing the minorities seniority to benefit a majority is illegal.
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Old 05-01-2013, 05:13 AM
  #816  
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Originally Posted by cactiboss
Uh oh, looks like company just threw usapa under the bus.

http://leonidas.cactuspilots.us/West..._PI_Motion.pdf
They're throwing every US Airways and American pilot under the bus.

Management wins when they weaken any union and reinforce any basis for litigious infighting.

Monies paid out in a DFR are less monies available for negotiating, grievances and future litigation not tied to this DFR case.

Make no mistake, your mentality is part of the problem cactiboss, but the tragedy as that you ill will is equally present on both sides of the USAPA.
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Old 05-01-2013, 05:25 AM
  #817  
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Originally Posted by cactiboss
It's a filing in Federal court by the company, maybe you should read it and make up your own mind?
Have you actually read it,or just taken your handlers word for it as you wrote them another check? Let me show you a few quotes that propaganda minister left out.

"insofar as plaintiffs’ motion is directed
at US Airways, the motion should be

denied because the only claim in plaintiffs’

Complaint asserted against US Airways, for

breach of the collectively-bargained Transition Agreement, raises

a “minor dispute” that is subject to the exclusive arbitral jurisdiction

of a Board of Adjustment under the Railway Labor Act. In any event, there is nobasis for the Court to issue an injunction against US Airways because plaintiffs’ motion does not assert that US Airways will oppose

the use of the Nicolau Award seniority list and, in fact, US Airways will not be presenting or advocating for th e use of the Nicolau

Award or any other seniority list in the

US Airways/American seniority-integration process"

"With respect to plaintiffs’ claim for breach of the duty of fair representation
(“DFR”) against defendant US Airline Pilots Association (“ USAPA”), US Airways remains neutral on the merits of the claim."



"There Is No Basis To Enter An In junction Against US Airways.
Plaintiffs’ Complaint contains only one cause of action against US Airways, for breach of the collectively-bargained Transition Agreement based on the allegations that an implied covenant of good faith and fair dealing embodied in th e Transition Agreement requires the use of the Nicolau Award in the US Airways/American seniority-integration process and that US Airways

breached that covenant when it entered into the MOUwithout expressly requiring the use of the Ni colau Award. (Compl. (Doc. No. 1) at¶¶ 101-112.) This claim raises a “minor dispute” that is subject to the exclusive arbitral jurisdiction of a Board of Adjustmen t under the Railway Labor Act. ( Accordingly, the Court does not have subject-matter jurisdiction over that claim and it cannot serv e as the basis for in junctive relief against US Airways."






"In any event, US Airways will not be presenting or advocating
for the use of the Nicolau Award or any other seniority list

in the US Airways/American seniority- integration process.

The MOU expressly provides that “US Airways . . .shall remain neutral
regarding the order in which pilots are placed on the integrated seniority list.”

The company wants this ripe because unlike our merger, if we are not integrated it will cost money instead of saving money. That doesn't mean they will get it. But even if they do, there are many more hurdles. A leader of AOL helped write the MOU, your attorneys told you to vote for it, you did and now you want to say it was illegal?

We were at a stalemate. We came up with an alternate solution and all agreed to it.
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Old 05-01-2013, 05:28 AM
  #818  
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Originally Posted by cactiboss
where did they say it would be doh? Usapa made it very clear that the mou was seniority "neutral" didn't they?
It is neutral with respect to our SLI-there won't be one and we keep what we have until the AA SLI. USAPA put out a letter saying that no west pilot should vote for the MOU thinking it would implement the Nic and no east pilot should vote against it because they fear it would implement the Nic. Had it not been neutral on our mess we would have never gotten a MOU and would have been on the outside looking in, waiting for judicial resolution. We ALL AGREED not to do that, but now you guys want to change the rules. Sounds like what you have been accusing us of all the time.
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Old 05-01-2013, 05:52 AM
  #819  
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Originally Posted by cactiboss
Case Law says that changing the minorities seniority to benefit a majority is illegal.
Only IF and WHEN that particular process is CONCLUDED...Meaning a joint CBA east/west. That never happened therefore NOTHING "illegal" about USAPA's right to bargain for the USA pilots..
The MOU serves as a legitimate union purpose for dis carting the nic...
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Old 05-01-2013, 06:49 AM
  #820  
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Originally Posted by R57 relay
Have you actually read it,or just taken your handlers word for it as you wrote them another check? Let me show you a few quotes that propaganda minister left out.

"insofar as plaintiffs’ motion is directed
at US Airways, the motion should be

denied because the only claim in plaintiffs’

Complaint asserted against US Airways, for

breach of the collectively-bargained Transition Agreement, raises

a “minor dispute” that is subject to the exclusive arbitral jurisdiction

of a Board of Adjustment under the Railway Labor Act. In any event, there is nobasis for the Court to issue an injunction against US Airways because plaintiffs’ motion does not assert that US Airways will oppose

the use of the Nicolau Award seniority list and, in fact, US Airways will not be presenting or advocating for th e use of the Nicolau

Award or any other seniority list in the

US Airways/American seniority-integration process"

"With respect to plaintiffs’ claim for breach of the duty of fair representation
(“DFR”) against defendant US Airline Pilots Association (“ USAPA”), US Airways remains neutral on the merits of the claim."



"There Is No Basis To Enter An In junction Against US Airways.
Plaintiffs’ Complaint contains only one cause of action against US Airways, for breach of the collectively-bargained Transition Agreement based on the allegations that an implied covenant of good faith and fair dealing embodied in th e Transition Agreement requires the use of the Nicolau Award in the US Airways/American seniority-integration process and that US Airways

breached that covenant when it entered into the MOUwithout expressly requiring the use of the Ni colau Award. (Compl. (Doc. No. 1) at¶¶ 101-112.) This claim raises a “minor dispute” that is subject to the exclusive arbitral jurisdiction of a Board of Adjustmen t under the Railway Labor Act. ( Accordingly, the Court does not have subject-matter jurisdiction over that claim and it cannot serv e as the basis for in junctive relief against US Airways."






"In any event, US Airways will not be presenting or advocating
for the use of the Nicolau Award or any other seniority list

in the US Airways/American seniority- integration process.

The MOU expressly provides that “US Airways . . .shall remain neutral
regarding the order in which pilots are placed on the integrated seniority list.”

The company wants this ripe because unlike our merger, if we are not integrated it will cost money instead of saving money. That doesn't mean they will get it. But even if they do, there are many more hurdles. A leader of AOL helped write the MOU, your attorneys told you to vote for it, you did and now you want to say it was illegal?

We were at a stalemate. We came up with an alternate solution and all agreed to it.
That makes my point exactly. The company throws usapa under the bus while wanting no part of the litigation. They have a point, it is usapa's duty to fairly represent the west not the company's. Silver said you needed an LUP to get rid of the Nic, you didn't have one and now negotiations for east/west are complete before you removed the Nic. from the TA. usapa told you that voting for the MOU doesn't trigger the Nic and told us that voting for the Mou doesn't trigger DOH. BTW the TA governs our merger and the MOU governs usair/aa merger. Go read McCaskill/Bond (the company did) it cannot apply to u/awa.
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