cactiboss

If usapa goes away before sli is done does apa inherit the Nic.? You east guys can't grasp that usapa is trying to replace the Nic. Usapa isn't starting fresh, usapa is actively trying to replace the Nic with something else. The apa will inherit the Nic and like usapa the apa will need a legitimate union purpose to reorder the Nic.

Carl Spackler

Yup. That right there.

This is exactly how I've perceived many west pilots' motivation. The courts will likely see it that way as well. Courts look for justice...not to aid in "taking people out".

You've got a tough lesson coming your way cactiboss.

Carl

cactiboss

. Yup us westies sure are a group of irrational people. Hanging on to our contractually ordered and neutral arbitrator rendered seniority list. What scumbags we are.

Carl Spackler

Of course you know, I never said that. You're using the tired old tactic of putting your words in the mouths of others, then castigating them for saying what only you've said.

This is what I did highlight as troubling:

For you to think that a court will help you in "taking people out", shows an incredible misunderstanding of the judicial system.

Carl

cactiboss

Ever here of "figure of speech"? Look it up.

CaptainBigWood

Originally Posted by cactiboss
I can tell you with a straight face that we will do whatever it takes to take the east pilots out, we only care about that.
Time for some humor: Take the East pilots out?
Does that mean your going to kill us and dump us in the Delaware River. :-(
Or buy the East pilots all a beer. :-)

LittleBoyBlew

There you go altering reality to perceive a fantacious result. I think they call this INSANITY...How is the nic the LCC pilot list??? How did IT come to pass? And how would the APA shield itself from an east DFR suit if it accepts something that never was??
The SLI protocols are clearly specified in the MOU...How do you propose to obtain an injunction against something that YOU overwhelmingly ratified?? Your case would require "merit", something that IT clearly lacks..

cactusmike

I think you meant Hail Mary, in other words, a long toss with marginal chance for success? That may be your opinion. The courts will decide on the merits of the case.

I still don't get why you believe a vote for the MOU was an endorsement of USAPA' s actions on the seniority issue, the outstanding grievance issue, the lawsuits starting with the RICO suit, the cactus 18, listgate, etc. The fact is that we now have the highest dues of any union and the least amount of effective representation for said dues.

The MOU was voted on because it gets us to the next step. It implied nothing regarding seniority because it was designed to be passed. West pilots were involved in negotiating the MOU and they endorsed it. That's why it passed by 98% in PHX. We knew that we would now be able to force the next step, the implementation of the Nicolau or the DFR case if the Nicolau was not used.

All sides were warned prior to this step, going back to last fall. The company knew this was coming. The APA was told that we would insist on the Nicolau as the LCC list and that we would take steps if it was not used. I would imagine the APA is waiting to see how this shakes out. They, like the company, will stay on the sidelines until a point comes where they may incur a liability for their actions or inactions. Again, the legal system will make that determination.

I see this all as a good thing. This is the end game and will determine how the integration gets settled. The east/west SLI will be settled and the McCaskill Bond process will define the LCC/APA integration. With American asking today for an extension on the exclusivity period it looks like management is waiting for things to be settled here before the POR takes place.

R57 relay

Withe above in mind, from the complaint:


"106.The MOU fails to provide terms needed to integrate pilot
operations.
107. The Transition Agreement requires that pilot seniority will be
implemented using to the integrated seniority list created according to
ALPA Merger Policy and accepted by US Airways – the Nicolau Award list.

108. The MOU fails to provide that pilot seniority will be
implemented using the Nicolau Award list.
109. Based on the forgoing, adopting the MOU is a breach of the
Transition Agreement implied covenant.
110. Despite vigorous protests by the West Pilots, USAPA refuses to
assert breach of the Transition Agreement implied covenant."

So you knew what was in the MOU, but you voted for it anyway to argue you had ripeness, then claim it is illegal. You saw that it talks about replacing all former contracts and status quo, but cling to the Transition agreement.

Amazing.

MOU 10h:

"h. US Airways agrees that neither this Memorandum nor the JCBA shall provide a basis for
changing the seniority lists currently in effect at US Airways other than through the process set forth in
this Paragraph 10."

R57 relay

[QUOTE=cactusmike;1371196]No one on the west is saying the MOU is illegal. /QUOTE]

"109. Based on the forgoing, adopting the MOU is a breach of the
Transition Agreement implied covenant."

What's that? Sure looks like Marty is saying it's illegal.