AOL update
03-08-2013, 08:50 PM
#401
Banned
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,240
No, here's the deal: USAPA and the company produced an agreement that brings everyone more money and a part in the world's largest airline. That same deal has also probably rendered the Nicolau award moot. The west pilots voted 95% in favor of what USAPA negotiated, including you I'll bet. This was a "legitimate union purpose" which was proven by your 95% acceptance vote.
Now do you see why there is absolutely no DFR? You can continue to provide a full employment act to your attorneys...but you have no case. None. Were I the judge, I would dismiss it in summary judgment.
Carl
Now do you see why there is absolutely no DFR? You can continue to provide a full employment act to your attorneys...but you have no case. None. Were I the judge, I would dismiss it in summary judgment.
Carl
Last edited by cactiboss; 03-08-2013 at 09:02 PM.
03-09-2013, 05:27 AM
#404
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2011
Position: A320 Capt
Posts: 5,299
"usapa and the company came with something they believe gets them around the Nic." What? Two of the people involved in the MOU process were west pilots, and one of them is a major player in AOL. They helped write it, they encouraged it, your attorneys had plenty of time to read it and obviously they recommended it, otherwise you guys wouldn't have voted for it in the numbers you have. I thought that you pronounced that the company and AOL wrote the MOU as a trap for USAPA, but perhaps that was another west Clarence Darrow on another board.
For the time I have been on the board you have been screaming, crying whining about the treachery of USAPA for using the language in the TA for getting around the Nic. You wouldn't do the same, would you?
Now, back to the latest DJ. Based on what you have said, I don't see the new DJ adding one thing to help with your premise. Everything that you predict will happen could happen without it. So, why the suit? Why spend the money and burden a very busy court?
03-09-2013, 05:30 AM
#405
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2011
Position: A320 Capt
Posts: 5,299
We all take our seniority to the dance and it buys what it will with the arbitrators decision(or if a miracle happens, the negotiated one).
03-09-2013, 07:40 AM
#406
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2011
Position: A320 Capt
Posts: 5,299
A few snippets from "As the Army Turns":
“52.
The Nicolau Award created an in
tegrated seniority list that
placed approximately 500 of the most
senior East Pilots at the top of the
list because they flew wide-body airc
raft and no West Pilot flew such
aircraft. “
WRONG. Most of them did not fly the 76 or 330.
“57.
ALPA’s Executive Committee ordered the East Pilots to
implement the Nicolau Award.”
WRONG. They told the west they could not force it until there was a JCBA.
“7.
Pursuant to the duty of fair
representation, USAPA must have a
legitimate union purpose to use anyt
hing other than the Nicolau Award
list to integrate East Pilots and West Pilots. “
In the current case that LUP has not been definded.
“98.
USAPA does not have a legitimate union purpose to use
anything other than the Nicolau Awar
d list to integrate East Pilots and
West Pilots. ”
Just saying something doesn’t make it so.
“102.
The Transition Agreement had an implied covenant of good faith
and fair dealing.”
And since it wasn’t completed before the SLI came out, defacto veto power.
“105.
The MOU is a single agreement that provides materially
improved wages for US Airways pilots (East and West).
106.
The MOU fails to provide term
s needed to integrate pilot
operations.
107.
The Transition Agreement requires that pilot seniority will be
implemented using to the integrated
seniority list created according to
ALPA Merger Policy and accepted by US Airways – the Nicolau Award list."
The courts have said that all sections of the contract can be renegotiated. Subject to DFR and LUP which they have said could not be determined yet.
"108.
The MOU fails to provide that pilot seniority will be
implemented using the Nicolau Award list.
109.
Based on the forgoing, adopting the MOU is a breach of the
Transition Agreement implied covenant.”
You guys know all of this and voted for it! By an overwhelming majority!
“52.
The Nicolau Award created an in
tegrated seniority list that
placed approximately 500 of the most
senior East Pilots at the top of the
list because they flew wide-body airc
raft and no West Pilot flew such
aircraft. “
WRONG. Most of them did not fly the 76 or 330.
“57.
ALPA’s Executive Committee ordered the East Pilots to
implement the Nicolau Award.”
WRONG. They told the west they could not force it until there was a JCBA.
“7.
Pursuant to the duty of fair
representation, USAPA must have a
legitimate union purpose to use anyt
hing other than the Nicolau Award
list to integrate East Pilots and West Pilots. “
In the current case that LUP has not been definded.
“98.
USAPA does not have a legitimate union purpose to use
anything other than the Nicolau Awar
d list to integrate East Pilots and
West Pilots. ”
Just saying something doesn’t make it so.
“102.
The Transition Agreement had an implied covenant of good faith
and fair dealing.”
And since it wasn’t completed before the SLI came out, defacto veto power.
“105.
The MOU is a single agreement that provides materially
improved wages for US Airways pilots (East and West).
106.
The MOU fails to provide term
s needed to integrate pilot
operations.
107.
The Transition Agreement requires that pilot seniority will be
implemented using to the integrated
seniority list created according to
ALPA Merger Policy and accepted by US Airways – the Nicolau Award list."
The courts have said that all sections of the contract can be renegotiated. Subject to DFR and LUP which they have said could not be determined yet.
"108.
The MOU fails to provide that pilot seniority will be
implemented using the Nicolau Award list.
109.
Based on the forgoing, adopting the MOU is a breach of the
Transition Agreement implied covenant.”
You guys know all of this and voted for it! By an overwhelming majority!
03-09-2013, 10:19 AM
#408
Banned
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,240
We all take our seniority to the dance and it buys what it will with the arbitrators decision(or if a miracle happens, the negotiated one).
03-09-2013, 10:44 AM
#409
Banned
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,240
You are confounded because you are morally bankrupt when it comes to our situation. You believe that what usapa has done is not only legal but morally just. Using the majority to get out of your agreements ( what you couldn't get in arbitration you took by force) and harming your fellow coworkers is not a good thing and never will be. You guys are so morally lacking that you can't tell the difference in legitimacy between a third party arbitrated list and one that is made up by the larger group for its own benefit .
Last edited by cactiboss; 03-09-2013 at 10:59 AM.
03-09-2013, 12:10 PM
#410
Back on TDY
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: 747-400 Captain
Posts: 12,487
O...K...
No, I've never said that. I've only said that you have no DFR case whatsoever after this vote. Your lawyers know that too, but are trying to bleed everyone dry in the interim.
You're right that DOH would basically be a staple, and as such, will never happen thanks to McCaskill-Bond. I've said you should agree to take your two separate lists to the APA merger.
Carl
You're right that DOH would basically be a staple, and as such, will never happen thanks to McCaskill-Bond. I've said you should agree to take your two separate lists to the APA merger.
Carl
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
