PurpleTurtle

Indeed it has. A cursory observation of history reveals the immanence of said stain.

John Prater is merely emblematic of the stain that pilots allowed to metastasize in their ranks (It isn't John Prater's fault). Continental Airlines had more scabs than any in the industry, yet John Prater was instrumental in persuading ALPA to welcome them all back into the union as members in good standing, in exchange for brining CAL's dues back into ALPA. Anything for dues. Dues forgave all. Nothing was sacred. If there ever was a time that ALPA held anything sacred, that proved no longer the case with the elevation of John Prater to ALPA president. Only a stained collective conscience could reward that.

The same stained conscience allowed TWA pilots to be tossed to the feet of APA, in hopes of wooing the AMR dues back into the fold.

It is a repeated stain on the collective soul of ALPA that tens of millions of dollars has been necessary to restore sacredness to seniority because ALPA chose the preeminence of dues over all else. Those who excuse ALPA's ineptitude, hostility, or apathy to anything more sacred than its own dues are indeed passive participants in that stain, at the least.

In fairness ALPA has made a slight attempt at redeeming themselves, maybe. The ALAP merger policy was amended, but they still outsource the determination of seniority. Oxymoron of oxymoron... a union outsourcing.

Wiskey Driver

Ok because it doesnt effect you, you feel justified in telling others about the stain. We have LIVED it man! Now am I sick of it? Certainly. Now knowing that means what to you the ones not effected?? What exactly would your advice be to those who have been completely screwed over by a group who makes a deal then refuses to honor it? This should be really good so Mr. you have the floor.

WD at AWA

cactiboss

...............

757HI

Doesn't affect me, eh? You know what they say about assumptions…

I am a PHX based US pilot. 757 Hawaii evidently provided no clue

West and east pilots arguing back and forth with each other on a web-board is just stupid.

Will you change their mind? Will they change yours? It's a waste of energy bro. Keep sending checks to Leonidas, like I do, each month. Let the process play out.

Lets talk about things that we can actually use to help our efforts to put three pilot groups into one, to learn about each others' cultures, managers, contracts, tactics, and building some unity.

We all three pilot groups better learn how to play nice in the sandbox because, boys and girls, we are in in contract talks.

CaptainBigWood

Well said 757 HI. The lack of unity will hurt all USAirways pilots. I have low expectations and am content where I am. DP wants APA to be happy and that is what he will get.

Wiskey Driver

My apologizes!!!

It is my understanding that usapa has once again failed to represent the west pilots and as a result that west negotiating committee members have resigned. Usapa can not be gone soon enough.

WD at AWA

757HI

No sweat WD.

We have got to figure out a way to see eye to eye, and work among ourselves with this transition period and JCBA process.

Parker's MO is crystal clear.

Placate the larger group, and divide the pilot groups and keep them distracted and arguing with each other while the company negotiators run us over with a steam-roller.

Lets not be that stupid this time.

cactusmike

Well said. Once this is over, and it will be soon, everyone will need to start pulling on the same rope. The problem would have been solved with east and west years ago under normal circumstances. The process that was agreed to would have ended and life would have gone on under a combined workgroup.

Now we have a seniority process that is much tighter and there will be little room for shenanigans. Someone will get butthurt after this is over, it may even be me, since I am senior on the west list. But whatever happens, the SLI will be done and we will go on with our lives. Everyone now knows what is at stake in this integration. Do we want it to go smoothly, like Delta, or dysfunctional, like US? I think we all want this ended soon and per the MOU process.

757HI

cactusmike,

I'm a 'rip the bandaid off fast' kind of a guy. I smell an anal raping in my future, but arguing about it with east pilots on APC isn't going to solve any problems.

The SLI is out of the line pilot's hands.

You are right, and I'm glad you see my point; do we want to be like Delta, or NW/Republic, United/Continental?

Delta is making money hand-over-fist, is running a good airline, and is taking their brand forward. They are kicking butt. Have you read the Delta thread? It's full of gaiety and laughter over there! Read the US thread and it's nothing but fear, hatred and anger.

We have a lot of hard work to do, and we all need to take a good, long, hard look in the mirror.

Lets keep the sights set on getting what will happen done fast, and then move forward from there.

cactusmike

Yes indeed. Like you said, lets let this game play out and then we go on to the next and bigger game, a parity contract that gets back the work rules we have lost in the MOU.