cactusmike

By the way, Relay, what do you think about the political maneuvering over Hummel and his ability to appoint committee chairs? I thought his letter about the end around by the BPR was in line with what Cleary had done before. I can't believe the same guys keep floating up to the surface.

Wiskey Driver

No I voted to put a new collective agreement in place that triggered the NIC under the TA and the award. What did you think we were voting for? To give the east a raise out of LOA 93 hell?? Not a chance there and in fact you had a better shot at sleeping with Sandra Bullock than our doing that!

WD at AWA

Wiskey Driver

Well I am not on the awappa boards but I didnt not respond to his post because it left out very important aspects. I certainly understand incentive based thinking but in this case APA has no real dog in this fight other than to see the merger get done.

Second there would be no way for APA to shield itself from lawsuit for having colluded with usapa in its attempt to further harm west pilots. See in the end some entity (court) is going to have to define binding arbitration and this will not only have a major impact on airline employees but on any group that uses arbitration to settle disputes.

The bottom line is that an agreement between east and west was to go to arbitration using the very arbitrator that the east had chosen. Each side knew that by going to arbitration and not settling the disputes in house that each side would be placing their futures in the hands of a third party. It is really just that simple. Now for me if I just use the kirby numbers and add up the what I lost plus the time I have left until 65 its $1.425 million cut me a check and the east , apa lcc who ever can have my ID. Not a dine less will I take to settle either. Now if not having to honor your agreements mean that much to the east and others then pay people. Again, it really is just that simple.

WD at AWA

R57 relay

I think the entire BPR is dysfunctional.

Any new organization hits bumps in the road, but USAPA has that and the many divisions of our group. Not just east/west, but two different POV's on the east. I feel that Hummel thinks he has to work around all these factions to get anything done.

If the merger goes through I hope the APA works better, but I've seen the same trends through every large group I've been associated with like a church board, PTA, and our previous union.

R57 relay

Thing is, what you voted for expressly says it doesn't trigger the TA, it changes it just like Hogg said above.

I voted for the MOU because I didn't listen to everyone else, I read it myself and I came to the exact conclusion as Hogg stated in his denial letter.

R57 relay

The APA is not responsible for what we bring to the table. The problem with the rest of your argument is that you AGREED to change and void the document you want fulfilled.

There is no cutting a check for you sport. You want it both ways-to get what you had without fulfilling the TA, then to use the TA when you agreed to change and nullify it. Not going to happen, IMHO as always.

To this date the TA has not been completed. It never will be, as it goes poof when the merger takes place.

Here's what I think will happen, but I wouldn't put any money on Judge Silver.

-She will not order USAPA to use the Nicolau award going into a AA/US merger.
-She will grant the west separate status in the SLI process.
-Several groups will come out and sue for the same status. One group was going to already, but I think they decided to wait and save their money.
-USAPA will appeal, using the words of west pilots against themselves as you guys have said over an over again there is no one to negotiate for the west except the legally elected CBA-USAPA.
-There will be NO DAMAGES to anyone. The TA was never completed, so there cannot be damages.

Wiskey Driver

Again NO thats what you said it says. To me I know an entity can not craft a document that illegally removes my rights. Like I said I voted for a new collective agreement and that agreement tirggers the NIC under the rules of the TA.

WD at AWA

Wiskey Driver

So basically your feeling is that they arbitration award will cease to exist based on the fact that usapa has successfully avoided having to put it in place by delaying the negotiation of a new contract?

The west will have a seat at the table without question. The TA was never completed due to east deceit which I am certain that every arbitrator in the world is now completely aware of. Now here is something that you need to grasp and quickly. usapa has shown the world how to stall and if we were to be hosed in some sham of a process then you best be ready for more years of stalling. APA east and west will continue to rot under these conditions until the final court hearing in 2030 long after im retired.

Like I said, some court will have to finally define BINDING ARBITRATION.

WD at AWA

R57 relay

The TA says it can be changed at any time with the consent of all parties. We did just that.

I don't know how Judge Silver will rule, but feel very confident that you are wrong in your understanding of the MOU and what you actually voted for. We'll see.

R57 relay

It's not binding if we all agree to get rid of it. It wasn't binding in our case anyway until the TA was completed. We never did that, we amended and terminated the TA.