R57 relay

You imagine? You tell me that I'm in for in "a rude, albeit slow, awakening" yet you imagine? Have you not learned anything since you have been here?

At this time we are governed by the transition agreement. It calls for a JCBA before any SLI can be used. We don't have one. We have a conditional one, one base on a merger that the DOJ has filed suit to block. If that happens, we have no JCBA, no implementation of a SLI, so as of today there is no damage to the west group from the east. They have lost no advancement because the TA was has not been completed and absent that completion-separate operations. There is loss, but is because of other factors, ones they were warned about. Those same separate operations have allowed you to be more senior than you would have been as a third lister.(Did I get that right? I seem to remember that you were a third lister)

Have you educated yourself? Have you read the TA and the various court filings? The MOU and what it actually says?

You still didn't answer the original questions about what he hell WD was taking about in the "award." Do some research and get back to me.

FreighterGuyNow

I would disagree. The TA said separate ops till a new contract plus an additional 12 months before a joint bid was posted.

No joint contract, no date certain, no new pay rates to quantify losses.

However, if you were to be correct there haven't been 1700 available Captain upgrades or open wide body jobs out East. So, even if they could somehow prevail only a small group of the most senior might see a payout but it won't be the entire West pilot group.

R57 relay

The thing the drizzle seems to be lost on is that the current DFR is about USAPA's actions with regard to the MOU. Their previous DFR failed and the courts said that there was no claim until we had a JCBA. It's not that there is anything magic about a JCBA, it's that in this case the JCBA is what completed the TA and completing the TA was the requirement for using the Nicolau award. Until the TA is complete there is a REQUIREMENT for separate ops. Separate ops-no damage.

The west pilots seem to think that any old JCBA will do, but the JCBA they voted for(Silver says it's a JCBA) changed the document that would trigger the Nicolau award and says it won't be used.

Judge Silver distilled this DFR to one question-did USAPA fail it's DFR by not including the Nicolau award in the MOU. No merger, no MOU, no DFR and back to square one. The west lawyers said this.

The Drizzle

I like your thoughts on the matter, but I'm not as hopeful.

I have in fact read as much as I could since I've had access to the entire library on the USAPA site. Reading and watching the progression of rulings tells me that USAPA is grasping at straws.

I've stuck my nose in enough on this topic. I'll have no control of my destiny until enough retirements make the 3rd listers a viable voting block.

I'll leave this echo chamber to you and the west boys.

R57 relay

Great answer.

There is no rude awaking for me. I've been living and active with this battle for 8 years. I have listened to both sides. I might be wrong about what is happening, but I very aware of it.

Wiskey Driver

Completely incorrect! The only requirement would be to show damage right? Ok so how does one define damage? The way that airlines have done this in the past is called pay protection. The minute that one pilot on the list became captain ahead of one senior to them on that list damages begin. This has being going since the east refused to honor the arbitration. Every west first officer is senior to the most jr east captain therefore its an easy case to make.

No one out west has sued or gone to court on that basis alone. The DFR was never about damages but rather merit. The 9th circuit viewed that case based damages to west careers but as often the case with the 9th (check their record) they got it wrong. If the case had included damages from the onset the 9th could have reviewed that along with merit and this thing would have been over years ago.

AOL made a huge mistake not asking for damages in the beginning ie can't get what you don't ask for.

WD at AWA

R57 relay

You're wrong. There is damage, damage to the east and west. The east's pay, the west career progression and pay, but it's because of the TA. It was agreed to by both parties. Under it there cannot be combined operations until we have a JCBA. There was no required timeline for a JCBA. We never got there, so the rest is irrelevant. The west pilots missed out on bidding east vacancies, the east missed out bidding west vacancies. SEPARATE OPERATIONS.

Want to sue someone? Sue yourself for the TA and the west's delaying lawsuits.

cactiboss

No, no it doesn't. You are one delusional puppy.

R57 relay

Then why the DFR cacti? You know what Judge Silver says the DFR is really about now, right?

Judge Silver:

" In other words, the West Pilots’ claim is that USAPA
breached the duty of fair representation when it entered into the MOU because the MOU
does not require USAPA use the Nicolau Award in the McCaskill-Bond process."

How can it be in there if you are suing because it is not in there?

cactiboss

The Mou is seniority neutral, no where does it say the Nic. won't be used or doh will be used. The MOU addresses only AA/US seniority.