B757200ER

Why is it unthinkable? It has been discussed/debated.

BTW, AA has been the ugly girl at the prom noone wanted to dance with ever since UA/CO, SW/AT and DL/NW hooked up. They didn't get that way overnight, either! You reap what you sew...

eaglefly

That won't solve the problem of no viable business plan and only force mainline labor to entrench themselves deeper in opposition.

If Horton wants leverage and momentum back, he'll have to deflate his credibility, soften his "steep spine" and offer ALL mainline labor something of substance.

Even with that, I can't see trust EVER returning. Of course, he could go "Kmer Rouge" and turn AA into a 1970's Cambodia tyranny state, but what message is sent to creditors and investors ?

He's got a big problem.

aa73

You are the only one I know who says this. Everyone in the industry labelled USAir as such. Hey, I'm not saying AA is very pretty today, but it's kind of telling when it's USAir who's been actively courting everyone in the industry for the past 5 years - not AA. It's also kind of telling when industry analysts point out that it's USAir who needs AA more than AA needs USAir.

As usual, your blind hatred for anything related to AA causes you to spew your emotional blather in any direction hoping that some of it might make sense. It doesn't.

PS... how do you sew what you reap?

757200ER, your new theme song is, "Ramble On" Led Zeppelin

buddies8

Actually AA was in talks with NWA, UAL and CAL for merging prior to those carriers choosing an other at the dance. If I am not mistaken, AA and US Airways talked about merger before when everyone else was french kissing.

AA was something when Crandall was here, ever since his retirement AA/AMR has been second rate EXCEPT in the employee ranks.

eaglefly

Actually, AMR shouldn't even have AA in Chapter 11 right now. How many corporations have filed Chaper 11 with 5 billion in cash ?

They had 18-24 months to get to the financial point of the other carriers at their loss rate and the ONLY point of this whole mess, is the interest in crushing labor costs. They would have been happy to manipulate the broken negotiation process under the absentee landlords of the NMB for another 2 years, but senior pilot retirmement increases and the possible parking of 767's and 777's and destroying even more premium customer loyalty and lost market share boxed them into a corner and they jumped earlier then planned.

No doubt the C11 was planned as far back as early summer, but AMR was planning more along the lines of this fall to administer the coup-de-grace to labor.

Now look at 'em.

eaglefly

Merger discussion is always going on from time-to-time as the industry morphs and changes. I'm sure Jet Blue has talked with others, although that doesn't mean anything is seriously imminent.

buddies8

true, point was there have been talks before and will be again.

Tomahawk58

Now that the hype has started to wane just a bit, let's take a dispassionate look at where things stand:

1. You have to really love a CEO whose willing to engage in a midnight tryst with the APA, then promise them DAL + 3 percent but won't bring his own pilots, FA's and FSC's together let alone bring their wages and benefits up to AA's standards; forget DAL's! (APA said they got more down in a week than 5 years. How long have you US folks been trying with Doug?)

2. Aside from a small wage increase, Doug promise very little above what AA is currently proposing in the term sheets before the courts.
- Identical DC plans (the cards are shuffled slightly but the amount comes out virtually the same.
- Scope is virtually the same in both proposals - the commuters get 1/2 the number of ac as the mainline in either proposal.
- PBS is on both lists.
- Sick is actually even more restrictive at US. Our pilots currently top 9 percent on the sick list on any given day. Nothing like helping the company that pays our salary. Nah, sitting home and whining is much better.
- Job protection. Let see, we AA pilots come out the best with about 400 job cuts, but when you factor in deliveries, the number will probably be even smaller. Does anyone seriously believe Doug will carry an additional 30,000 employees in a post-merger AA/US relative to DAL and UAL?

3. Interestingly enough, the APA has pulled out all the stops to sell what is essentially, a modest pay raise by attempting to cast their lot with Doug.

4. The height of hubris in my opinion is the APA's position that we (AA) are better off to merge during the BK process. I guess those DAL folks didn't have a clue as to what they were doing by telling Doug thanks but no!

5. If anyone believes the APA and Doug attempted to cut a back room deal because they're concern about the employees at US, don't kid yourself.

6. We keep believing absent a sustained profitable model at AA, US or any public company worth anything we can continue to operate.

7. The ultimate irony is that the US folks on this board and some AA guys with their own agendas discounts US's 2 trips down BK lane, along with DAL, NWA, CO and UAL BK visits, but takes AA to task for getting its cost under control across the entire company. Every single employee at AA is impacted by this not just us pilots!

8. Many on this forum have never allowed fact to stand up to emotion!

9. AA will present it's POR by 9/28/12. Doug has not presented anything yet other than hollow promises backed up he hopes by AA's cash! Sort like a man attempting to steal another's wife then asking the wife to take the husband's money so the two of them can live happily ever after. Well, it sometime works in the movies, but real life is another story altogether.

Those who believe they are "entitled" will always feel that way!

eaglefly

Ahh, the management "spinmaster" is back. From AA labor perspective, it seems like this is the only "love" they've felt in 10 years. Since then, it appears to have been scorn, disregard, abuse, belittlement and any number of other negative interactions.

I suppose that's fault of the ENTIRE front-line labor at AA too, eh ?

I guess a wage increase doesn't count, but it's more then just a 'little ole' wage increase'. Considering the proper pay band placement of the A319's, the absence of gutting various international and night times, etc. and other things, it adds up to substantial differences. The DC plan details are still not specific, but bound to be at least equal. Scope is MUCH better then AMR's blank check of 250+ E-190's for Eagle and unlimited code-sharing that hands the rest of AA domestic over to others. E-190's with U stay at MAINLINE. My bet says Parker will be better with PBS (I've heard it's not so bad there, at least on the west side). In AMR's draconian hands, PBS would be sure to be a nightmare for pilots. Not worried about sick issues with this deal and job protection is positive vs. negative with AMR.

Perhaps Parker knows how to RUN an airline and thus might be able to make his plan work vs. simply just emasculating your labor for profits ?

Your attempt to gloss this down compared to AMR's "death sheet" is laughable, but let's say all the above baloney of yours isn't covered with green fur.

If that's the case, what does that say about an entire labor force so eager to abandon their current management, they'd take an equal deal from someone else ?

It says to me, the current management of this airline is SO far out of touch with their employees, they're not even in the same company. It also says to me, creditors and investors should seriously question ANY future crafted or controlled by those whose labor has abandoned them en masse, so easily. It isn't the best deal, by far, simply the best OPTION considering the situation.

Clearly you are not only anti-labor, but anti-APA as well as indicated by points 4-9 above. In fact, I'd consider you 'anti-pilot'. The only thing that has failed in the last 4 1/2 months worse then the handling of this bankruptcy, is your feeble attempt to protray yourself as just another "fellow pilot" looking to "discuss the issues". Your agenda (assigned or voluntary) is oozing from every pore.

We are where we are and AA employees have had enough. Parker didn't have to work all that hard to make this happen and that says everything. Clearly, if your bosses are anything like you, nothing's been learned and thus the show will go on as AA labor has nowhere to go but elsewhere. As far as "entitlement"..........well, there's an old saying in business and that's "you don't get what you deserve, you get what you NEGOTIATE".

Since Parker was willing to negotiate and AMR isn't, this is where we are. AMR hasn't negotiated in 5 years..........perhaps they forgot how ?

tailwheel48

Not without court approval!