LBFO79

I hope you are correct. Unfortunately AA classes are completely full, and always will be. Everyone comes to AA thinking things will improve in the future. The joke is on all of us however. AA really does not even have to negotiate a contract that evem meets jetblue or spitit rates, and of course they certainly will never have to offer QOL contract enhancements that would bring us closer to airlines like spirit, jetlblue, or Alaska. The classes are full and will be in the future too.

When the 'scientifically accurate' polling comes back to APA and tells them the pilots want a quick deal, they will then revert to negotiating sub-jetblue payrates , with some concessions like continuous duty overnights and others, sprinkled with some per diem increases. Then the pilots will send a bunch of soundoffs saying they don't want to be paid less than every other airline in the United States and don't want concessions, then APA will conduct more scientifically accurate telephone polling and run an Ad in the Dallas Morning News saying AA pilots have had enough. Then I imagine, we will finally file for mediation sometime in 2024, and reach an agreement shortly thereafter in the Spring 2024 timeframe. The agreement will, one-year later, only match Delta rates, and offer little to nothing in terms of QOL enhancements. Retro will likely increase to about 1/2 of what Delta received.

Then, life will go on at AA. The ORD chair will win another BOD election, AA recruiters will talk about all the upcoming retirements and increased pay, even though it will still trail every other airline in total compensation and benefits. Upgrades and time to widebody will continue to occur faster at United and Delta, evem with AA's retirements. The cycle will repeat every 5 years.

ultimately, until we file for mediation and/or AA pilot new-hire classes start with empty seats, AA negotiators will continue to play dumb and slow-roll the pilots. They will offer nothing of real value, and certainly nothing that equates to industry-standard.

Beech Dude

Classes will stay full, but as guys take a date here while waiting on DAL or UA, and then subsequently leave, attrition will become a problem added to the retirements. This is exactly why NK/B6/AK are ahead of us now. They're absolutely hemorrhaging pilots. Our NC needs to call them out on the baloney and keep leverage not give give give "just to get something." File for mediation will most likely happen again. Didn't we file in July? And ya know, maybe put the fear into the company/actually strike.

Armyguy

Never because we suck now

4thgenaviator

Thanks for the thoughts, everyone. I asked the original question because I left DAL for AA because of the choice to live in base. My family and I live in a major hub for AA, and are unwilling to move given our current situation. I’m holding out hope that AA will be able to provide compensation and QOL on par with, or better than, everyone else. One can hope. 🤞

LBFO79

im rooting for you. I think most or all of us want this airline and union to be successful, we just have not been given much to work with to lift our spirits.

The good news is, our horrible pilot demographics and lack of unity will likely be improving in the years and decades to come.

ImSoSuss

I don't get this "AA will drag their feet because classes are full" narrative. You don't think classes were full over at Delta?

The difference was a united pilot group and a strong union. THAT is the difference. Stop with this "classes are full" nonsense I see all over the various boards. It's a Legacy, what do you expect?

pilot28042

If the pilot group keeps turning down TAs in the future wouldn’t that require mediation anyways?

Why would anyone vote YES to something less than our peers at DAL/UAL regerding pay and QOL?
We can get it - just gotta make sure the voices are heard through the vote to get it.

PRS Guitars

You made the right choice. It will work out. If LBFO79 is correct…and he could be…you can bail. I don’t think he is correct. We will lose 100 plus new hires this year, as most will in this environment. If AA and APA drag their feet and we aren’t making progress this winter, we will lose a lot more, including pilots that have been here for several years. Our training department can’t keep up with that, and we can’t just keep reducing flights. The old “AA retirements are massive” argument isn’t that important in todays environment. Jumping ship when 2000 will quickly be behind you is a nothing burger. Yes, of course we will fill classes, but we will be a stepping stone. Don’t buy the doom and gloom and don’t pre spend money from an anticipated contract.

ImSoSuss

This is the most senior pilot group in the U.S., maybe the world. They have been beaten down so many times that they have Stockholm Syndrome at this point where they will say yes to any piece of turd passed down to them from the Company. Also the BOD put a little sweetener in there to get the old guard to sign, and that was an extra week of vacation for those over 25 years seniority. This TA was definitely fixed to get a 51% to 55% vote to pass which is why thank god it never got to a vote because it would have passed.

You know how many CA's I've flown with on the line that would have signed our embarrassment of a TA because ""ItS bEtTeR tHaN nOtHiNg" and "YoU nEvEr KnOw WhEn ThE nExT dOwNtUrN wIlL hIt".

While both of those may technically be true, it is definitely worth the risk to take advantage of the best negotiating environment ever seen for pilots.

pilot28042

Crazy to think that it’s better than nothing mentality. I can easily live off this contract right now - if a downturn happens I’m fine. Vote for a better life in the long run not for the next 3-5 years lol

I just want an 18 hour call out and some reassignment pay so we stop getting abused
And positive space commuting