Dobbs18

They don't get it or better yet don't want to hear that side of the argument because they know its a loss for them....If you want a bump in priority(above OAL in a new tier on ALL AA branded flights) then Republic should have no problem extending the same bump in priority on ALL Republic operated flights, whether that's DAL or UAL branded flights, its yall's JS right? You control it right? They big 3 don't control it right? Propose that to APA and see what they say. Just bc DAL and UAL bent over and that makes it "industry standard" in your eyes doesn't mean that APA has to or will do the same. You want to change it so AA pilots go as OAL on AA branded flights operated by Republic, fine, we will see how long that last. APA swings a much bigger bat than Republic teamsters do, sorry it sounds childish but they do. Time will tell how this thing plays out, both parties are clearly on different sides on this one, so we will just have to see how it shakes out in the real world now.

Longhornmaniac8

As you have said previously, there's no such thing a perfectly reciprocal when you're dealing with entities different in size. That isn't what reciprocal means, and you know that. The spirit of reciprocity should be to get it as close to even as possible.

To the best of my knowledge, the APA has never even approached Republic or the Jumpseat Committee asking for priority on all our flights. On a purely personal level, I'd be ok with that.

As it stands, we offer AAG pilots a priority bump on close to 50% of our flights. Meanwhile, AA doesn't offer jumpseats internationally, so that takes away, what, 30ish percent of your daily departures (in the before times) that Republic guys can't jumpseat on? I'll readily concede that 50%/=70%, but it's a hell of a lot closer to equal than 50% is to 0%.

But here's the thing, all your name calling/misrepresenting the position of Republic pilots doesn't take away from the notion that at the end of the day the position of the guys on here vehemently against this change is rooted in selfishness rather than cooperation and camaraderie. "We don't get XYZ, so why should you, even though this doesn't affect us, directly or indirectly." Any one of us at Republic would gladly trade our position with yours. This isn't remotely about thinking we're better than anyone, on the contrary. We're trying to make our jobs suck a little less, especially because we are considerably more dependent on the jumpseat than anyone at AAG, owing to our lower priority (which is fair, just low).

Again, this change has zero impact to ALL AAG pilots. Republic pilots have been on record all over the place that we vastly preferred option 1, which (rightly) retained your priority on our jumpseats. Literally the only thing AA pilots have to do is acknowledge that Republic pilots contribute more to the AA system than a Spirit guy, and you seem unwilling to do that for some reason. It's a truly bizarre hill to die on.

The comments about fencing are equally bizarre. All pilots at Republic contribute to the overall operational integrity of both Republic and therefore the American networks. If a pilot commuting to work a Delta trip misses out on an AA jumpseat, and we have to staff that trip with a reserve, it's one fewer reserve we have to use for an American trip.

All this posturing about fairness and misusing of reciprocity and conflating of cabin seats and jumpseats and this is what it boils down to. AA/AAG/APA have had two options. Either help their colleagues at a partner airline that contributes (substantially) to their operation, or shoot themselves in the foot. This isn't coercion or blackmail. Republic pilots have been getting the short end of the stick for quite a while now, while AA has been the beneficiary, and we are entirely within our right to treat AA folks the same way we are currently treated. And when we deign to treat y'all the way we've been treated this whole time its [surprisedPikachuface.jpg].

C'mon man.

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vessbot

I forgot to mention: in effect that is what they're asking for, since under the proposed system they would be using their priority about half the time, the other half being on the other 2 networks' flights.

sanicom3205

You guys don’t get to pull the camaraderie brotherhood card. The stage was set for this with what happened when you guys screwed with United and the sanctity of the js like two years ago. If you wonder why there’s animosity - look no further than the history books

captive apple

sanicom3205 did you know this?

Longhornmaniac8

I can write paragraphs about the United saga, and of you want to go there we can take it to the PMs, but it's an entirely different situation with entirely different circumstances.

That said, you addressed one small part of my post (that is almost totally a strawman to the topic at hand) and ignored the rest.

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Cujo665

learn how reciprocal is used in JS agreements. It’s an agreement to carry each others pilots. That is where it stops. Have you ever negotiated a JS agreement? I have. What’s reciprocal is the agreement to carry each others pilots as JSers free. The how many and under what conditions are covered under the reciprocal agreement. There is nothing requiring 100% the same level of priority or unlimited seating.

Cujo665

key word, owned. Endeavor (owned) pilots do bump AA and UA.
own metal
own company (parents and subsidiaries)
OAL

its not a difficult concept.

Longhornmaniac8

This is a great example of technically correct but functionally wrong.

Find me one other agreement anywhere that puts the two airlines party to an agreement on unequal footing, where one gets a priority bump and the other doesn't. They simply don't exist. There is either no relationship between the two beyond a "will carry" and therefore no expectation of "special" treatment by either side, or there is a relationship beyond that where BOTH parties receive a bump.

This idea that reciprocal can mean "unequal" is a solid mental contortion, even for you.

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greatmovieistar

What a well thought out response to longhorn's post. Your continued misrepresentation of the United issue has already been debunked. Give it up, you and El Paso are getting killed here.