Allegiant Purchased 6 757's???
07-16-2009, 01:24 PM
#51
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Joined APC: Feb 2008
Position: Boeing's Plastic Jet Button Pusher - 787
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Does anyone have any evidence that Allegiant actually desires ETOPS aircraft?
I know the trend with 75's these days is to try to use them on low density over-water routes (or high density routes if you don't have a widebody to put on the route), but is this what Allegiant plans to do with them?
I assume that a 757 can generate lower costs than a MD-80 on a medium length route if you can get people in the seats. Is the plan really to use them for potential ETOPS route expansion, or just to use them on current higher density medium haul routes (Florida to Vegas?) where a 75 would generate better economics than a MD-80?
I know the trend with 75's these days is to try to use them on low density over-water routes (or high density routes if you don't have a widebody to put on the route), but is this what Allegiant plans to do with them?
I assume that a 757 can generate lower costs than a MD-80 on a medium length route if you can get people in the seats. Is the plan really to use them for potential ETOPS route expansion, or just to use them on current higher density medium haul routes (Florida to Vegas?) where a 75 would generate better economics than a MD-80?
This may give your quandary some direction. I believe this more-or-less points to the fact that they are, verses the fact that they are not. Don't really see any otherway to make the Hawaiian Islands by air w/o ETOPS aircraft. Like you, I would still like to hear more info, but this is a good start to your question.
Beat of Hawaii and Beyond: Travel Deals, Tips, Culture and Analysis Allegiant Buys 757s: Hawaii Service Update
Last edited by SoCalGuy; 07-16-2009 at 01:49 PM.
07-16-2009, 03:15 PM
#52
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Joined APC: Feb 2007
Posts: 27
ETOPS-equipped 757s have more safety equipment, more system redundancies. They have a Hydraulic Motor-Generator as an electrical system backup, higher-power and more reliable APU and better Class D cargo fire-fighting system for overwater. The maintenance program is much more detailed and most everything on the jet has to work to fly 180-minute ETOPS, ie Hawaii.
As a few side notes; ALGT could always just buy the Pace Airlines certif. which is still out there and 'forsale' has 757/76 on the certif. and as far as I know ETOPs.
Also, was noted earlier, the conversion cost to make a 757/76 to ETOPs, can cost $1.5-3 or 4 Mil. depending on what is needed. Also, documenting the Mx reliability info. can be very extensive.
Additionally, as far as the current price of 757s, last yr. UAL sold 15 of their 75s, (with a leaseback arrangement to raise cash), and if i remember it only amounted to about 7 to 7.5 Mil/airframe. However, that was for older, non-ETOPs airframes, but with the global economy worse in the last yr. especially in Europe and Asia, the demand for 75s and thus the prices have declined.
For what its worth.
PD
07-16-2009, 03:54 PM
#53
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Posts: 926
Also, Allegiant uses Aeroturbine (located on the field) for refurbishing services....(I think mostly for paint.)
If the thing rolls out of the shop in Allegiant livery, I'll post a pic.
07-16-2009, 06:24 PM
#54
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Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 19,617
Also, don't forget that ETOPS 757/76s have a 'second crossfeed valve' in the fuel system. If you had an engine failure overwater and the crossfeed valve failed to open; if you did not have the redundany, the a/c would have fuel it could not use.
As a few side notes; ALGT could always just buy the Pace Airlines certif. which is still out there and 'forsale' has 757/76 on the certif. and as far as I know ETOPs.
Also, was noted earlier, the conversion cost to make a 757/76 to ETOPs, can cost $1.5-3 or 4 Mil. depending on what is needed. Also, documenting the Mx reliability info. can be very extensive.
Additionally, as far as the current price of 757s, last yr. UAL sold 15 of their 75s, (with a leaseback arrangement to raise cash), and if i remember it only amounted to about 7 to 7.5 Mil/airframe. However, that was for older, non-ETOPs airframes, but with the global economy worse in the last yr. especially in Europe and Asia, the demand for 75s and thus the prices have declined.
For what its worth.
PD
As a few side notes; ALGT could always just buy the Pace Airlines certif. which is still out there and 'forsale' has 757/76 on the certif. and as far as I know ETOPs.
Also, was noted earlier, the conversion cost to make a 757/76 to ETOPs, can cost $1.5-3 or 4 Mil. depending on what is needed. Also, documenting the Mx reliability info. can be very extensive.
Additionally, as far as the current price of 757s, last yr. UAL sold 15 of their 75s, (with a leaseback arrangement to raise cash), and if i remember it only amounted to about 7 to 7.5 Mil/airframe. However, that was for older, non-ETOPs airframes, but with the global economy worse in the last yr. especially in Europe and Asia, the demand for 75s and thus the prices have declined.
For what its worth.
PD
07-17-2009, 04:37 AM
#55
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Posts: n/a
The problem with the 757 for ETOPs was getting fuel from the center tanks when you are down to the HDG-Hydraulic Driven Generator. The center tank pumps were not powered when you are on HDG power. Believe it or not ATA came up with the solution. By adding a larger HDG and changing some wiring sources they were able to power 1 center tank pump when on HDG and now you have a 180 ETOPs airplane. Larger cargo fire extinguisher bottles had to added and probably other things I have forgotten.
Greg
former ATA 757 Captain
Is Allegiant hiring?
[email protected]
Greg
former ATA 757 Captain
Is Allegiant hiring?
[email protected]
07-17-2009, 05:47 AM
#56
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Joined APC: Apr 2009
Position: Hiding under the counter
Posts: 276
hahahaha thats clever.
The only reason i mention it is because from what I understand all of allegiant's pushback tugs are too low to accomidate the 757. So having brand new tug which can adjust height could or could not mean something.
The only reason i mention it is because from what I understand all of allegiant's pushback tugs are too low to accomidate the 757. So having brand new tug which can adjust height could or could not mean something.
07-18-2009, 06:30 AM
#57
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Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 45
The problem with the 757 for ETOPs was getting fuel from the center tanks when you are down to the HDG-Hydraulic Driven Generator. The center tank pumps were not powered when you are on HDG power. Believe it or not ATA came up with the solution. By adding a larger HDG and changing some wiring sources they were able to power 1 center tank pump when on HDG and now you have a 180 ETOPs airplane. Larger cargo fire extinguisher bottles had to added and probably other things I have forgotten.
Greg
former ATA 757 Captain
Is Allegiant hiring?
[email protected]
Greg
former ATA 757 Captain
Is Allegiant hiring?
[email protected]
07-18-2009, 10:27 AM
#58
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Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: MD80 Captain
Posts: 165
07-18-2009, 03:30 PM
#59
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Joined APC: Apr 2009
Position: Hiding under the counter
Posts: 276
This is actually now our second tug.
usually we try to power out. But there are times when we have 3 aircraft on the ground at a time and have to pull them straight in, due to our limited ramp space. Or, like for the next few weeks, we have ramp construction requiring us to pull the planes straight in.
Should be interesting if the rumors of basing another plane out here comes true.
usually we try to power out. But there are times when we have 3 aircraft on the ground at a time and have to pull them straight in, due to our limited ramp space. Or, like for the next few weeks, we have ramp construction requiring us to pull the planes straight in.
Should be interesting if the rumors of basing another plane out here comes true.
07-18-2009, 08:02 PM
#60
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Posts: 279
Just came across this one...
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Untitled-(US-Airways)/Boeing-757-225/1554995/L/
Airways putting away 75's?
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Untitled-(US-Airways)/Boeing-757-225/1554995/L/
Airways putting away 75's?
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