tailendcharlie

The fact Ed Faith is here & we still don’t have AQP says way more about Allegiant than it does about AR or the union. When, top to bottom, they decide to act like a real airline and treat their pilots accordingly, AQP will move forward. A can of beets with a new label is still a can of beets.

JediCheese

If we're going to shrink, we're not losing Captains off the top so then we'd have to lose them off the bottom. So what happens when the downgrades happen? Hope we're in such a depression that rivals the 30's so they can retain pilots?

414to412

“The company should have been paying that the entire time”. Exactly. But they were not. Now they are.

As for removals with VFNs, it is an established fact if the conflict is same-day, removed without pay. If the removal is the next day, you are paid for both. Email TT, RCPO, read the arbitration, ask on the line.

I’m not saying everything is perfect, but these are some examples, in addition to what you mentioned, if getting soft pay. Contract needs an overhaul but for the folks saying soft pay will never amount to anything, here are examples of it.

tom11011

FAA said no to aqp because of Boeing program. Limited FAA resources.

j3cub

This. Currently the FAA said they will not sign off on AQP and 737 concurrently. One then the other.

akulahunter

This and all of the above comments close to this are ignorant. EF has said multiple times in ground school classes, etc that the FAA is the one that pulled the plug on AQP (due to the company wanting to add a second type). They weren't willing to let the company undergo two huge changes simultaneously. He also made it pretty clear that the reason AQP wasn't completed prior to his hiring was that the company personnel working on it were out to lunch. Maybe ask EF his opinion, so far he looks like a straight shooter.

Margaritaville

Yeah. Because they wanted to keep the jeopardy aspects of a PC but still call it AQP. To keep using the training department as a weapon. Both AR and the FAA told them to pound sand on that. That's not how AQP works.

The 737 thing is just a convenient excuse to put off something they didn't want to do in the first place. I don't envy EF, he thought he could walk into a buzz saw and stop it with his head.

9easy

There is a misconception that AQP is some panacea where you can never fail and everything is jolly.. Not true. And ask yourself, do you really want to fly with other people, who at a certain point can't accomplish basic maneuvers or do a LOFT/LOE without maintaining a safe operation? An unsatisfactory training event just means you get retrained, try again, and move on with life. The last place I worked at, you could also "fail" the AQP knowledge test.

Straight from the FAA: In AQP demonstration of proficiency in maneuver oriented technical skills is a necessary but insufficient condition for pilot qualification. For pass/fail purposes, pilots must also demonstrate proficiency in LOE’s which test both technical and CRM skills together.

FreshWater

Agreed. AQP is more weighted as relevant and predictable training. Cuts down on the Tasmanian devil syndrome types that are attracted and encouraged in a Testing department. Limits the “Pet-Peeve” gotcha-projects that flourish under testing departments, that are left to their own devices, due to lack of oversight and resources.

Removes and/or limits the specter of an unpredictable “X” factor due to one instructor over another. And in some cases, anyone who has been here long enough can recall a few pilots that were “re-trained” out of existence, for various unstated or stated reasons. It’s that overarching tool that could be used by management for animus or retaliation that management likes to have just laying around, for everyone to see.. Fear.. Intimidation..

The threat of our enforcer minded management to have as an unstated not often used tool in their arsenal is something they want to keep.

Margaritaville

That sounds like something someone in the training department would say.

I've worked at AQP airlines before. I know how it works. The beauty of AQP is that the MV (maneuvers validation), the traditional PC part where currently we're tested on stuff we seldom do, is training, trained to proficiency but if you're not proficient, you don't advance, you get remedial, not a pink slip. You also have First Look and SPOT training based on FOQA and ASAPs that we don't have. The evaluation is an LOE loft on line operations where you demonstrate integrated knowledge levels.

Our training is ridiculous. We don't have a training department, we have a checking department. It's an exercise of stump the dummy twice a year. I recall a certain manager in the training department even trying to claim someone could fail an RFT and the FAA pretty much stepped on his nuts with that. I don't buy this "prove you deserve your job every 6 months" crap. Most of the people who have made it to this level know what they're doing and if they don't that's what newhire training and probation are for. There's no need for you guys to bust everyones balls twice a year and make everyone sweat check rides so you can satisfy your own need to feel like the smartest guys in the room. It's long overdue for G4 to get on board with modern airline training practices, not beating pilots up twice a year. Doing that only encourages pilots to study just enough to pass. That's why AQP came about in the first place. It's meant to create more knowledgable and thus safer pilots, because it focuses on real world items not to make training "easier".

This is also why we need AQP. It standardizes things, no more "ooh I have a checkride with so and so and he likes to ask blah blah blah" or "SD he's a hardass maybe I'll just call out", which the company hates. It gets everyone on the same page with standardized curriculum and grading standards, not the current "I'm known as a hardass and I like it" or "I personally think you're a slacker, therefore you're going to have the hardest checkride of your life" or "the company doesn't like your criticism online and we have been told to give you a thorough checkride".