skyvanman

Can you? Can anybody? No, all we have to go off of is a non-corroborated letter from GU with absolutely ZERO supporting evidence to back up his claims. GU is an absolute maniac who is so self-obsessed he will stop at nothing until he is king of his own ant hill. You're honestly going to tell us that GU, an idiot who negotiates sh*t for Atlas, Republic, Horizon, Northern Air Cargo, etc... suddenly now knows how to negotiate better than a guy who negotiated at American and US Air? Get real.[/QUOTE]

There is "evidence" as you so call it in a form of a TEXT message Owen's himself sent to some in AR's inner circle were he clearly states his disdain for the IBT, and how it was a power grab and how AR was a victim of it all. He did this after clearing being told to cut off any/all communications with AR and any union member. Surprised you haven't seen it. We get it, you don't like GU. You have your reasons and well, even if many disagree, your opinion should be "respected". After all this is a nation that protects free speech. That doesn't make you correct. The negotiating committee has been given tremendous resources and autonomy, to were GU is not in the room, or pulling the strings. I think you're describing AR when he "removed himself" from the NC and place J.O and S.A.

You know what the funny part was, that right before the slates were official, AR called me, asking me if I had heard who was going to run against him. He assumed that S.A was going to run against him, and he was so convinced of it that he told me many of S.A "dirty little secrets". And told me that he knew all his skeletons and he would crush him if he dared to run against him. When it turned out to not be S.A, and then S.A endorsed him AR warmed up to him, and decided to place him to lead negotiations. Hmmm I wonder what sort of "deal with the devil" they made. Those are some facts for ya.

Carry on.[/QUOTE]

What, you suddenly have forgotten what you and half the base have branded yourselves? The videos are up on the website, maybe it will be best if you go back and revisit them yourself. Let's dive in... J.R. specifically stated that we cannot afford to remain in negotiations for years. Yes, you are correct in saying that he desired to bring in true experts, but you fail to appreciate that he also desired to strike a deal in short order to ensure we as a group do not lose money over minscual gains. Spare me the lecture on accusing me of wanting the money and nothing else, you'd be wrong. It is critical we achieve appropriate protections throughout the contract. Now, John Wentz? Talk to me about the guys expertise. I recall GU and the NC talking his expertise up as if he had negotiated at carriers such as southwest, united, etc. Can you tell me what PILOT contracts Mr. Wentz has negotiated? Do you think that we are best represented by an expert who has minimal experience negotiating a contract at one of our peers and instead has most of his experience from negotiating other RLA working groups?

As I've said before, you and I know each other and go back years, so I can assure you that we feel the exact same regarding AR. But it's time to leave AR in the past, he no longer deserves a moment of our time. We as a group cannot move forward if we forever focus on the past.


Owen's was hired to achieve a contract for our pilots in short order. As you said in your own words, he too is entitled to his own opinion. It just so happens that how he views the internal affiars of our local has absolutely zero impact on his work at the negotiating table. The guy successfully negotiated pilot contracts at USAir and American Airlines, how on earth does this make him less qualified than the JV team GU has pulled together? Spare me the mention of JO being removed from the committee at American, talk to any of our American buddies and they'll tell you he was brought back less than a week later to finish this most recent contract. You are 100% correct, I cannot stand GU. He lied straight to my face in 2016 and he's doing it to this pilot group once again. GU is a true self-serving bottom feeder who needs to leave Allegiant pilots alone. For h*ll's sake, the guy wanted to be a chief pilot here and when he got told no, he never forgave G4. It's so funny you say the NC has full autonomy now and GU doesn't participate. You were listening to the call the other day where GU verbatim stated that he regularly participates in negotiations. He is the only vote when it comes to putting a contract to vote, don't be so short sighted. He's participating. He was responible for the sh*t stain of the 2016 contract and now we get GU CBA 2.0.

Captainbfv

It's really funny, in one sentence you say lets leave AR behind. Put him in the past, lets focus on the present. Yet you can't seem to let go of GU and the past. GU admitted publicly of the failures of the last contract, yet still stated... "it was a wholy war" and basically it was the best or what was agreed. S.A was part of that negotiating team too no? Yet AR placed him back as lead negotiator. J.O might've been experienced, but what about the other two idiots in the room? M.T and A.B? Should they have been there? J.O requested them to be in there, and they were agreeing to absolute ********ry bc J.O would look to them for guidance on things we had no clue. Such as larry limos or rental cars among other things. You keep saying we've known each other for years... I don't know you, and I say that because you don't have the absolute huevos to contact me. Instead you keep hidding behind this screename that you created in March of this year. So I THINK, I THINK I can narrow down to who you are. You're either in the training department, or you're someone that recently got a stick up you arse bc GU wouldn't give you a position as a stewart? Am I in the ball park?

So no, you spare me your one slanted opinion and until you have the cojones to talk to me on the phone or in person like a man, then to me you obviously have a chip on your shoulder. I can't say that I sympathize or empathize bc I haven't gotten my "feelings hurt" by GU. It is OBVIOUS that you haven't talked to anyone in the NC in recent weeks/months. And much less had the balls to tell GU what you really think.

GU was "responsible" for the *******stain contract we have now. AR is resposible for the ********stain negotiations and representation we had for YEARS until a few months ago. The next few months will tell how wrong we "got it again" or how "well it all worked out". So spaaaaaaare me with your inability to have a pair to contact me.

skyvanman

You're right, I cannot let go of GU and the past because unlike AR, GU is directly impacting the lives of each pilot here. AR has no bearing on any of us anymore-- the same cannot be said for GU. So until GU is gone and we have responsible, respectable, intelligent ALLEGIANT PILOTS representing ourselves, I will not leave GU in the past.

You said the quiet part out loud, GU admitted that he is an incapable negotiator and he delivered us this lovely CBA. Tell me brother, what has GU done in the time since 2016 to learn how to properly negotiate? Have you talked to pilots at Atlas about their contract? The one GU couldn't get done so it was settled in binding arbitration? Is he going to use his knowledge of negotiating at Northern Air Cargo to get us across the line? Or is it Silver Air? Which peer airline has GU negotiated a pilot contract for? Yes, SA was apart of that team, as was SW, and CG, all three of whom should be nowhere near the table again. SA's run at the table this year was limited to what, 6 days of negotiating? I don't think he could've f*cked it up if he tried in that short of time. MT and AB look like 20 somethings, I think my kids are older. I don't know how they got there in the first place but I specifically remember GU telling the whole pilot group that HE CHOSE those two to remain as apart of the team and he advocated for them several times via Zoom. JO didn't exactly strike me as the type of guy to keep unneeded guys in the room with himself. Obviously we all hear rumors about the content of negotiations but I would love to know how you feel so confident sharing "fact" that is protected by NDA. Ah, that's right JK can't help himself and talks to much.

We have known each other, FOR YEARS, doesn't look so good to get all high and mighty behind a keyboard does it? Brother this is you daily on here, WhatsApp, and Facebook. You are the true Drama Queen of our airline. I'm not going to say whether or not I'm hanging out in SFB, nor am I going to say whether I had desired to actually help the pilots by becoming a *steward*.

jimmy8

Can you? Can anybody? No, all we have to go off of is a non-corroborated letter from GU with absolutely ZERO supporting evidence to back up his claims. GU is an absolute maniac who is so self-obsessed he will stop at nothing until he is king of his own ant hill. You're honestly going to tell us that GU, an idiot who negotiates sh*t for Atlas, Republic, Horizon, Northern Air Cargo, etc... suddenly now knows how to negotiate better than a guy who negotiated at American and US Air? Get real.[/QUOTE]

There is "evidence" as you so call it in a form of a TEXT message Owen's himself sent to some in AR's inner circle were he clearly states his disdain for the IBT, and how it was a power grab and how AR was a victim of it all. He did this after clearing being told to cut off any/all communications with AR and any union member. Surprised you haven't seen it. We get it, you don't like GU. You have your reasons and well, even if many disagree, your opinion should be "respected". After all this is a nation that protects free speech. That doesn't make you correct. The negotiating committee has been given tremendous resources and autonomy, to were GU is not in the room, or pulling the strings. I think you're describing AR when he "removed himself" from the NC and place J.O and S.A.

You know what the funny part was, that right before the slates were official, AR called me, asking me if I had heard who was going to run against him. He assumed that S.A was going to run against him, and he was so convinced of it that he told me many of S.A "dirty little secrets". And told me that he knew all his skeletons and he would crush him if he dared to run against him. When it turned out to not be S.A, and then S.A endorsed him AR warmed up to him, and decided to place him to lead negotiations. Hmmm I wonder what sort of "deal with the devil" they made. Those are some facts for ya.

Carry on.[/QUOTE]

If you think John Wentz is a good “expert” to have in the room then you’re clowning big time. Dude has no real experience and the little he does have he has accomplished **** contracts. Owen’s is hands down the best expert we’ve had at the table and the fact we aren’t out there getting more consultants with real experience negotiating the Big 3 contracts tells me all I need to know about the supreme leader GU

tom11011

There is "evidence" as you so call it in a form of a TEXT message Owen's himself sent to some in AR's inner circle were he clearly states his disdain for the IBT, and how it was a power grab and how AR was a victim of it all. He did this after clearing being told to cut off any/all communications with AR and any union member. Surprised you haven't seen it. We get it, you don't like GU. You have your reasons and well, even if many disagree, your opinion should be "respected". After all this is a nation that protects free speech. That doesn't make you correct. The negotiating committee has been given tremendous resources and autonomy, to were GU is not in the room, or pulling the strings. I think you're describing AR when he "removed himself" from the NC and place J.O and S.A.

You know what the funny part was, that right before the slates were official, AR called me, asking me if I had heard who was going to run against him. He assumed that S.A was going to run against him, and he was so convinced of it that he told me many of S.A "dirty little secrets". And told me that he knew all his skeletons and he would crush him if he dared to run against him. When it turned out to not be S.A, and then S.A endorsed him AR warmed up to him, and decided to place him to lead negotiations. Hmmm I wonder what sort of "deal with the devil" they made. Those are some facts for ya.

Carry on.[/QUOTE]

What, you suddenly have forgotten what you and half the base have branded yourselves? The videos are up on the website, maybe it will be best if you go back and revisit them yourself. Let's dive in... J.R. specifically stated that we cannot afford to remain in negotiations for years. Yes, you are correct in saying that he desired to bring in true experts, but you fail to appreciate that he also desired to strike a deal in short order to ensure we as a group do not lose money over minscual gains. Spare me the lecture on accusing me of wanting the money and nothing else, you'd be wrong. It is critical we achieve appropriate protections throughout the contract. Now, John Wentz? Talk to me about the guys expertise. I recall GU and the NC talking his expertise up as if he had negotiated at carriers such as southwest, united, etc. Can you tell me what PILOT contracts Mr. Wentz has negotiated? Do you think that we are best represented by an expert who has minimal experience negotiating a contract at one of our peers and instead has most of his experience from negotiating other RLA working groups?

As I've said before, you and I know each other and go back years, so I can assure you that we feel the exact same regarding AR. But it's time to leave AR in the past, he no longer deserves a moment of our time. We as a group cannot move forward if we forever focus on the past.


Owen's was hired to achieve a contract for our pilots in short order. As you said in your own words, he too is entitled to his own opinion. It just so happens that how he views the internal affiars of our local has absolutely zero impact on his work at the negotiating table. The guy successfully negotiated pilot contracts at USAir and American Airlines, how on earth does this make him less qualified than the JV team GU has pulled together? Spare me the mention of JO being removed from the committee at American, talk to any of our American buddies and they'll tell you he was brought back less than a week later to finish this most recent contract. You are 100% correct, I cannot stand GU. He lied straight to my face in 2016 and he's doing it to this pilot group once again. GU is a true self-serving bottom feeder who needs to leave Allegiant pilots alone. For h*ll's sake, the guy wanted to be a chief pilot here and when he got told no, he never forgave G4. It's so funny you say the NC has full autonomy now and GU doesn't participate. You were listening to the call the other day where GU verbatim stated that he regularly participates in negotiations. He is the only vote when it comes to putting a contract to vote, don't be so short sighted. He's participating. He was responible for the sh*t stain of the 2016 contract and now we get GU CBA 2.0.[/QUOTE]

Jim Rockford

At this point nobody cares about any of this BS. We just want a contract and our money.

Captainbfv

I second that frankly; no argument there.

Captainbfv

What, you suddenly have forgotten what you and half the base have branded yourselves? The videos are up on the website, maybe it will be best if you go back and revisit them yourself. Let's dive in... J.R. specifically stated that we cannot afford to remain in negotiations for years. Yes, you are correct in saying that he desired to bring in true experts, but you fail to appreciate that he also desired to strike a deal in short order to ensure we as a group do not lose money over minscual gains. Spare me the lecture on accusing me of wanting the money and nothing else, you'd be wrong. It is critical we achieve appropriate protections throughout the contract. Now, John Wentz? Talk to me about the guys expertise. I recall GU and the NC talking his expertise up as if he had negotiated at carriers such as southwest, united, etc. Can you tell me what PILOT contracts Mr. Wentz has negotiated? Do you think that we are best represented by an expert who has minimal experience negotiating a contract at one of our peers and instead has most of his experience from negotiating other RLA working groups?

As I've said before, you and I know each other and go back years, so I can assure you that we feel the exact same regarding AR. But it's time to leave AR in the past, he no longer deserves a moment of our time. We as a group cannot move forward if we forever focus on the past.


Owen's was hired to achieve a contract for our pilots in short order. As you said in your own words, he too is entitled to his own opinion. It just so happens that how he views the internal affiars of our local has absolutely zero impact on his work at the negotiating table. The guy successfully negotiated pilot contracts at USAir and American Airlines, how on earth does this make him less qualified than the JV team GU has pulled together? Spare me the mention of JO being removed from the committee at American, talk to any of our American buddies and they'll tell you he was brought back less than a week later to finish this most recent contract. You are 100% correct, I cannot stand GU. He lied straight to my face in 2016 and he's doing it to this pilot group once again. GU is a true self-serving bottom feeder who needs to leave Allegiant pilots alone. For h*ll's sake, the guy wanted to be a chief pilot here and when he got told no, he never forgave G4. It's so funny you say the NC has full autonomy now and GU doesn't participate. You were listening to the call the other day where GU verbatim stated that he regularly participates in negotiations. He is the only vote when it comes to putting a contract to vote, don't be so short sighted. He's participating. He was responible for the sh*t stain of the 2016 contract and now we get GU CBA 2.0.[/QUOTE]

https://i.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc...ZAJk/giphy.gif[/QUOTE]

LOL

jimmy8

https://i.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc...ZAJk/giphy.gif[/QUOTE]

LOL[/QUOTE]

still no real email from the almighty supreme leader

tom11011

LOL[/QUOTE]

still no real email from the almighty supreme leader[/QUOTE]

I received 2 emails on the 9th, one was from the supreme leader and the other from the NC. Check your spam.