Alaska Air Hiring
06-11-2022, 10:39 AM
#6381
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Posts: 278
Angry cussing grasshopper, it’s called collective Bargaining for a reason. You enter negotiations at one place and through the bargaining process, emerge out the other end, You emerge with a TA molded through compromise. One key is to start with high enough openers and hold your ground.
The other side has aptitude and resolve as well. They’re typically better at it. They do it non-stop with ALL of your work groups. Pilot’s take a butter knife to a gun fight. If these things were not true, you wouldn't find yourself where you are, sucking hind-tit.
You don’t get the contract you deserve, you get the contract you leverage. The only real legal leverage the RLA gives you is the threat of a strike or an actual strike.
One more thing, your union is not just your MEC or your negotiators. It’s also all of the pilots. The question is whether the metal is moving. In the past, it has and therefore there was no reason for your management to yield to union aptitude and resolve. The history speaks for itself.
But, change has got to start somewhere. Maybe it’s already started to change. April 1st was impressive. A 99% strike vote? Impressive. Enough? Who knows. Time will tell.
Cuss me all you want
I still wish you good luck. It’s also called pattern bargaining for a reason.
The other side has aptitude and resolve as well. They’re typically better at it. They do it non-stop with ALL of your work groups. Pilot’s take a butter knife to a gun fight. If these things were not true, you wouldn't find yourself where you are, sucking hind-tit.
You don’t get the contract you deserve, you get the contract you leverage. The only real legal leverage the RLA gives you is the threat of a strike or an actual strike.
One more thing, your union is not just your MEC or your negotiators. It’s also all of the pilots. The question is whether the metal is moving. In the past, it has and therefore there was no reason for your management to yield to union aptitude and resolve. The history speaks for itself.
But, change has got to start somewhere. Maybe it’s already started to change. April 1st was impressive. A 99% strike vote? Impressive. Enough? Who knows. Time will tell.
Cuss me all you want
I still wish you good luck. It’s also called pattern bargaining for a reason.
Sent from my SM-A716U using Tapatalk
06-11-2022, 11:30 AM
#6382
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: This side of the dirt.
Posts: 897
Angry cussing grasshopper, it’s called collective Bargaining for a reason. You enter negotiations at one place and through the bargaining process, emerge out the other end, You emerge with a TA molded through compromise. One key is to start with high enough openers and hold your ground.
The other side has aptitude and resolve as well. They’re typically better at it. They do it non-stop with ALL of your work groups. Pilot’s take a butter knife to a gun fight. If these things were not true, you wouldn't find yourself where you are, sucking hind-tit.
You don’t get the contract you deserve, you get the contract you leverage. The only real legal leverage the RLA gives you is the threat of a strike or an actual strike.
One more thing, your union is not just your MEC or your negotiators. It’s also all of the pilots. The question is whether the metal is moving. In the past, it has and therefore there was no reason for your management to yield to union aptitude and resolve. The history speaks for itself.
But, change has got to start somewhere. Maybe it’s already started to change. April 1st was impressive. A 99% strike vote? Impressive. Enough? Who knows. Time will tell.
Cuss me all you want
I still wish you good luck. It’s also called pattern bargaining for a reason.
The other side has aptitude and resolve as well. They’re typically better at it. They do it non-stop with ALL of your work groups. Pilot’s take a butter knife to a gun fight. If these things were not true, you wouldn't find yourself where you are, sucking hind-tit.
You don’t get the contract you deserve, you get the contract you leverage. The only real legal leverage the RLA gives you is the threat of a strike or an actual strike.
One more thing, your union is not just your MEC or your negotiators. It’s also all of the pilots. The question is whether the metal is moving. In the past, it has and therefore there was no reason for your management to yield to union aptitude and resolve. The history speaks for itself.
But, change has got to start somewhere. Maybe it’s already started to change. April 1st was impressive. A 99% strike vote? Impressive. Enough? Who knows. Time will tell.
Cuss me all you want
I still wish you good luck. It’s also called pattern bargaining for a reason.
06-11-2022, 11:38 AM
#6383
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2018
Posts: 687
He also mentions time, and circumstances are not on our side. I call B/S on that. If this current climate is not the time to be snapped up to an on par, or close to on par contract, no other time will ever exist.
His pronouncements sounds to me like a management stooge trying to sow the seeds of doubt about what is achievable with the hope of getting some to believe it. That would go a long way in supporting that 50%+1 TA idea he's peddling.
Last edited by All Bizniz; 06-11-2022 at 12:02 PM.
06-11-2022, 01:35 PM
#6384
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2010
Position: A320 CA
Posts: 241
Comprehension isn’t most Pilots strong point which is a bit scary if you think about it since the job requires it🤦♀️… however, I actually agree with your initial assessment and thought it was spot on, don’t be dismayed by the ones who can’t read and comprehend… it’s all good😉
06-11-2022, 02:45 PM
#6385
missionary
Joined APC: Jun 2013
Position: Right seat 787 or missionary
Posts: 98
Let’s chair-fly this, hypothetically of course
Put yourself in their shoes. They are not going to fold like a cheap card table under your transparency, resolve, and aptitude. They have resolve and aptitude as well. They will use every play from their playbook. Those plays have worked in the past. If it’s not broken, why fix it? They have to try. They’d be remiss if they did not. They’d be shirking their responsibility if they didn't fight tooth and nail like the cheap bastages that they are. The unfortunate reality for them is that there is now a pilot shortage and they have failed to acknowledge and come to grips with the new reality. Their old cheapskate model no longer works is this environment. They just haven’t accepted the new reality.
None the less, the CFO will be sitting at the table. It’ll be a continued attempt at quid pro quo.
In the end, they’ll tell you here’s x-number of dollar$ and they cannot afford a penny more. They won’t care how you divide it up amongst yourselves or amongst the sections of the contract. They’ll push it across the table. What happens next is up to your negotiator(s) which serve at the behest of your MEC.
Alaska could also wait until the 11th hour and comeback with a TA, take it or leave it, their last and final offer, good only until midnight.
They will talk of growth and upgrades. They will task your Chief Pilot, Captain Nepotism, to sell their TA to your pilots. If the TA is voted down, he loses his job. He’ll be the next scapegoat. He’ll get some cushy lateral move or he’ll go back to the line to spend “more time with his family” or “doing what he loves, flying the line.”
see. Kotz is not the only prognosticator
Put yourself in their shoes. They are not going to fold like a cheap card table under your transparency, resolve, and aptitude. They have resolve and aptitude as well. They will use every play from their playbook. Those plays have worked in the past. If it’s not broken, why fix it? They have to try. They’d be remiss if they did not. They’d be shirking their responsibility if they didn't fight tooth and nail like the cheap bastages that they are. The unfortunate reality for them is that there is now a pilot shortage and they have failed to acknowledge and come to grips with the new reality. Their old cheapskate model no longer works is this environment. They just haven’t accepted the new reality.
None the less, the CFO will be sitting at the table. It’ll be a continued attempt at quid pro quo.
In the end, they’ll tell you here’s x-number of dollar$ and they cannot afford a penny more. They won’t care how you divide it up amongst yourselves or amongst the sections of the contract. They’ll push it across the table. What happens next is up to your negotiator(s) which serve at the behest of your MEC.
Alaska could also wait until the 11th hour and comeback with a TA, take it or leave it, their last and final offer, good only until midnight.
They will talk of growth and upgrades. They will task your Chief Pilot, Captain Nepotism, to sell their TA to your pilots. If the TA is voted down, he loses his job. He’ll be the next scapegoat. He’ll get some cushy lateral move or he’ll go back to the line to spend “more time with his family” or “doing what he loves, flying the line.”
see. Kotz is not the only prognosticator
06-11-2022, 03:59 PM
#6386
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2011
Position: Upright & Breathing
Posts: 320
Let’s chair-fly this, hypothetically of course
Put yourself in their shoes. They are not going to fold like a cheap card table under your transparency, resolve, and aptitude. They have resolve and aptitude as well. They will use every play from their playbook. Those plays have worked in the past. If it’s not broken, why fix it? They have to try. They’d be remiss if they did not. They’d be shirking their responsibility if they didn't fight tooth and nail like the cheap bastages that they are. The unfortunate reality for them is that there is now a pilot shortage and they have failed to acknowledge and come to grips with the new reality. Their old cheapskate model no longer works is this environment. They just haven’t accepted the new reality.
None the less, the CFO will be sitting at the table. It’ll be a continued attempt at quid pro quo.
In the end, they’ll tell you here’s x-number of dollar$ and they cannot afford a penny more. They won’t care how you divide it up amongst yourselves or amongst the sections of the contract. They’ll push it across the table. What happens next is up to your negotiator(s) which serve at the behest of your MEC.
Alaska could also wait until the 11th hour and comeback with a TA, take it or leave it, their last and final offer, good only until midnight.
They will talk of growth and upgrades. They will task your Chief Pilot, Captain Nepotism, to sell their TA to your pilots. If the TA is voted down, he loses his job. He’ll be the next scapegoat. He’ll get some cushy lateral move or he’ll go back to the line to spend “more time with his family” or “doing what he loves, flying the line.”
see. Kotz is not the only prognosticator
Put yourself in their shoes. They are not going to fold like a cheap card table under your transparency, resolve, and aptitude. They have resolve and aptitude as well. They will use every play from their playbook. Those plays have worked in the past. If it’s not broken, why fix it? They have to try. They’d be remiss if they did not. They’d be shirking their responsibility if they didn't fight tooth and nail like the cheap bastages that they are. The unfortunate reality for them is that there is now a pilot shortage and they have failed to acknowledge and come to grips with the new reality. Their old cheapskate model no longer works is this environment. They just haven’t accepted the new reality.
None the less, the CFO will be sitting at the table. It’ll be a continued attempt at quid pro quo.
In the end, they’ll tell you here’s x-number of dollar$ and they cannot afford a penny more. They won’t care how you divide it up amongst yourselves or amongst the sections of the contract. They’ll push it across the table. What happens next is up to your negotiator(s) which serve at the behest of your MEC.
Alaska could also wait until the 11th hour and comeback with a TA, take it or leave it, their last and final offer, good only until midnight.
They will talk of growth and upgrades. They will task your Chief Pilot, Captain Nepotism, to sell their TA to your pilots. If the TA is voted down, he loses his job. He’ll be the next scapegoat. He’ll get some cushy lateral move or he’ll go back to the line to spend “more time with his family” or “doing what he loves, flying the line.”
see. Kotz is not the only prognosticator
06-12-2022, 05:43 PM
#6389
missionary
Joined APC: Jun 2013
Position: Right seat 787 or missionary
Posts: 98
Ad hominem attacks, name calling, and insults? That’s all you got?
If nothing else, at least you’re consistent
.
Last edited by GearBoy; 06-12-2022 at 06:05 PM.
06-12-2022, 06:38 PM
#6390
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: This side of the dirt.
Posts: 897
Pot v Kettle…. Kettle v Pot
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