Alaska Air Hiring
01-27-2022, 03:54 PM
#5691
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2011
Posts: 79
Speed Pilot, thanks for that very good explanation on that aspect of how our unions work. I'm sure not all of us really realized how influential we can be in the process.
Curious question...
Over the years, we've heard many stories of MECs, industry wide, seemingly going against the wishes of their pilots, making deals, and presenting TAs or doing side deals that were unpopular, or ultimately had a negative effect. It's the reason why some pilots hate ALPA.
What motivates MECs to sometimes go rogue, if we can call it that?
Curious question...
Over the years, we've heard many stories of MECs, industry wide, seemingly going against the wishes of their pilots, making deals, and presenting TAs or doing side deals that were unpopular, or ultimately had a negative effect. It's the reason why some pilots hate ALPA.
What motivates MECs to sometimes go rogue, if we can call it that?
Honestly I have no good answers for it, and I’ve experienced it prior to AS.
There is very real human nature to use your power to benefit yourself instead of those you represent. (Seen this one way too often)
There’s the belief that since you know a bunch of information covered by NDA’s that the average line pilot will never know, or won’t educate themselves on no matter how much you try to feed it to them, that you know better and either can’t or don’t need to explain yourself. (Seen this one too sadly)
The time/value of money argument always pops up and scares those near the end of their careers into wanting to get a subpar deal done. I personally see little value in this argument but it has been used successfully many times in the past. (I don’t see this one working out here this time)
The pilot groups still hold the power with their vote and the ability to recall bad representatives, both of which require pilots to be actively engaged in their union with their representatives. An engaged group could have stopped those rogue MECs and LECs in the past. Many did by recalling them after bad deals were presented, sometimes before the bad deal because the group was engaged in their livelihood.
I like our MEC and our Negotiating Team. I think they know what we want and what we’d vote for.
My comment was spurred by ShyGuy seeming to think the LEC spoke out of turn in an email to their council. They didn’t. They are the LEC. They are the voting members of leadership. They set the direction of the MEC and Committees. The MEC manages that direction of the group and of the committees for the LECs.
01-27-2022, 04:00 PM
#5692
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2018
Posts: 677
Honestly I have no good answers for it, and I’ve experienced it prior to AS.
There is very real human nature to use your power to benefit yourself instead of those you represent. (Seen this one way too often)
There’s the belief that since you know a bunch of information covered by NDA’s that the average line pilot will never know, or won’t educate themselves on no matter how much you try to feed it to them, that you know better and either can’t or don’t need to explain yourself. (Seen this one too sadly)
The time/value of money argument always pops up and scares those near the end of their careers into wanting to get a subpar deal done. I personally see little value in this argument but it has been used successfully many times in the past. (I don’t see this one working out here this time)
The pilot groups still hold the power with their vote and the ability to recall bad representatives, both of which require pilots to be actively engaged in their union with their representatives. An engaged group could have stopped those rogue MECs and LECs in the past. Many did by recalling them after bad deals were presented, sometimes before the bad deal because the group was engaged in their livelihood.
I like our MEC and our Negotiating Team. I think they know what we want and what we’d vote for.
My comment was spurred by ShyGuy seeming to think the LEC spoke out of turn in an email to their council. They didn’t. They are the LEC. They are the voting members of leadership. They set the direction of the MEC and Committees. The MEC manages that direction of the group and of the committees for the LECs.
There is very real human nature to use your power to benefit yourself instead of those you represent. (Seen this one way too often)
There’s the belief that since you know a bunch of information covered by NDA’s that the average line pilot will never know, or won’t educate themselves on no matter how much you try to feed it to them, that you know better and either can’t or don’t need to explain yourself. (Seen this one too sadly)
The time/value of money argument always pops up and scares those near the end of their careers into wanting to get a subpar deal done. I personally see little value in this argument but it has been used successfully many times in the past. (I don’t see this one working out here this time)
The pilot groups still hold the power with their vote and the ability to recall bad representatives, both of which require pilots to be actively engaged in their union with their representatives. An engaged group could have stopped those rogue MECs and LECs in the past. Many did by recalling them after bad deals were presented, sometimes before the bad deal because the group was engaged in their livelihood.
I like our MEC and our Negotiating Team. I think they know what we want and what we’d vote for.
My comment was spurred by ShyGuy seeming to think the LEC spoke out of turn in an email to their council. They didn’t. They are the LEC. They are the voting members of leadership. They set the direction of the MEC and Committees. The MEC manages that direction of the group and of the committees for the LECs.
01-27-2022, 04:11 PM
#5693
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2011
Posts: 79
01-27-2022, 06:18 PM
#5694
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2017
Posts: 936
As I’ve already said. There is some great data out there on the recently published Delta contract comparison. Ours is getting dated, fast.
There is also very good but of course not perfect data out there here on the APC W2 thread.
Your peers who wound up at better airlines are also another source of information. That is if you’re humble enough to ask how they did on their bonus.
I’ll take extra money but I’m still asking for a market rate contract…
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
There is also very good but of course not perfect data out there here on the APC W2 thread.
Your peers who wound up at better airlines are also another source of information. That is if you’re humble enough to ask how they did on their bonus.
I’ll take extra money but I’m still asking for a market rate contract…
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
01-27-2022, 08:31 PM
#5695
Line Holder
Joined APC: Dec 2013
Posts: 91
What's better:
working at Alaska and getting a PBP pay out the past 3 years
or
working at the Big 3 and not getting any bonuses.....and still making more than the average Alaska pilot.
All my friends in and around my pay band, made about $20k more than me, without a bonus. Please don't fool yourself friends. They're not doing us any favors.
They have more than enough money to pay us what we're worth and pay us our PBP.
I trust our union. Honest to goodness. But you guys realize we're fighting and scrapping to simply get an industry standard contract, when everyone else is trying to raise the bar and better themselves. If and when we get a new contract, we're again, already are going to be behind.
working at Alaska and getting a PBP pay out the past 3 years
or
working at the Big 3 and not getting any bonuses.....and still making more than the average Alaska pilot.
All my friends in and around my pay band, made about $20k more than me, without a bonus. Please don't fool yourself friends. They're not doing us any favors.
They have more than enough money to pay us what we're worth and pay us our PBP.
I trust our union. Honest to goodness. But you guys realize we're fighting and scrapping to simply get an industry standard contract, when everyone else is trying to raise the bar and better themselves. If and when we get a new contract, we're again, already are going to be behind.
01-28-2022, 12:30 AM
#5696
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,915
My comment was spurred by ShyGuy seeming to think the LEC spoke out of turn in an email to their council. They didn’t. They are the LEC. They are the voting members of leadership. They set the direction of the MEC and Committees. The MEC manages that direction of the group and of the committees for the LECs.
I'd like to see a unified message among the LECs. If we are to start a strike fund, the SPC should send an email as well.
exactly! And this (6.2% PBP) is Alaska being just as disingenuous.
I read the letters from Management sent to us today. “See, we lost money, but we are still paying you!”
Well, that’s because we have a contract that says you have to, even if we didn’t, management never does anything out of the kindness of their heart. It is always a business decision.
They are most likely hoping the word of this “bonus” gets out and a few starry-eyed NewGuys and HotDogs will sign up to fly with us. Or they really do like us that much???
I read the letters from Management sent to us today. “See, we lost money, but we are still paying you!”
Well, that’s because we have a contract that says you have to, even if we didn’t, management never does anything out of the kindness of their heart. It is always a business decision.
They are most likely hoping the word of this “bonus” gets out and a few starry-eyed NewGuys and HotDogs will sign up to fly with us. Or they really do like us that much???
01-28-2022, 06:21 AM
#5698
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2017
Posts: 936
What's better:
working at Alaska and getting a PBP pay out the past 3 years
or
working at the Big 3 and not getting any bonuses.....and still making more than the average Alaska pilot.
All my friends in and around my pay band, made about $20k more than me, without a bonus. Please don't fool yourself friends. They're not doing us any favors.
They have more than enough money to pay us what we're worth and pay us our PBP.
I trust our union. Honest to goodness. But you guys realize we're fighting and scrapping to simply get an industry standard contract, when everyone else is trying to raise the bar and better themselves. If and when we get a new contract, we're again, already are going to be behind.
working at Alaska and getting a PBP pay out the past 3 years
or
working at the Big 3 and not getting any bonuses.....and still making more than the average Alaska pilot.
All my friends in and around my pay band, made about $20k more than me, without a bonus. Please don't fool yourself friends. They're not doing us any favors.
They have more than enough money to pay us what we're worth and pay us our PBP.
I trust our union. Honest to goodness. But you guys realize we're fighting and scrapping to simply get an industry standard contract, when everyone else is trying to raise the bar and better themselves. If and when we get a new contract, we're again, already are going to be behind.
I don’t see why anyone would come to AS and expect to be on par with Delta, United or American. We will always be trailing the big three. The question is by how much.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
01-28-2022, 09:18 AM
#5699
New Hire
Joined APC: Jan 2022
Posts: 7
02-04-2022, 03:51 PM
#5700
New Hire
Joined APC: Feb 2022
Posts: 1
Contact for Interview
Hi all,
New to the thread and I already need some help. I have an interview in 2 weeks and have no way of contacting the pilot recruitment dept. I misplaced the paper that I took notes on from the phone interview.
Hoping someone can PM me a good contact out there. Much thanks in advance!
New to the thread and I already need some help. I have an interview in 2 weeks and have no way of contacting the pilot recruitment dept. I misplaced the paper that I took notes on from the phone interview.
Hoping someone can PM me a good contact out there. Much thanks in advance!
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
