rickair7777

I think the gist of what some AS people (including me to some degree) are concerned about is...

HA pilots granted better seniority to account for WB expectations, then...

a) Mainland resident HA pilots who are tired of the commute use their new seniority to come in on top of AS pilots in west coast bases. This is hypothetical of course but even 100-200 people would have a big impact. LAX is probably most concerning since that already got a big hit from VX integration.

AND/OR

b) Route/fleet consolidation, boeing failure to deliver, etc driven musical chairs.


For those reasons I tend to prefer a DOH-ish solution with fences. In this case we might want to deviate from the norm and fence all bases or fleets. To the extent that OG pilots get first crack at their original fleets and then remaining vacancies go to whoever.

Of course HA pilots can be legit concerned about AS pilots coming for their WB's, but the usual ALPA process is known to address that.

It's not up to me, but our MEC's will be polling us soon and I'll state my case then.

I don't recall any artificial nonrev priority, so I think it's by actual DOH. You'd have to do that, since other employee groups nonrev too and you can't give a pilot priority over other senior longevity employees because of some pilot-specific SLI.

IFlyEm

Correct. Everything outside of bidding will be straight DOH.

word302

So much angst and animosity for something nobody knows what the outcome will be and none of us have any control over.

yallMahomies

This real question no is is asking: will WBs go to NH >2028? Also how will hiring stack up in the next 5-7 years? We are retiring a record number in 28-29. How is HAL looking like

Akamai

For any pilot hired after 12/3/23, yes that is a true statement as they will be integrated by DOH. If you looked at the TPA, and past arbitration awards, you would see that future orders are indeed considered. So, only any additional WB orders not already identified in the TPA are a career expectation of an AS pilot, regardless of when they are eventually delivered.

ShyGuy

Please don’t fight. We need unity. And then when one side proposes 15% longevity and 85% relative, and the other side proposes 70% longevity and 30% relative, you’re still supposed to have unity and act lovey dovey.


Can’t wait to see the SLI proposals from both sides, while in the same breath telling us to maintain unity.

word302

Why wouldn’t we remain unified? It’s the job of both MECs to fight for the best deal for their perspective pilot group. Just do your job and be civil, it’s all out of our hands.

rickair7777

Actually we do have some input... your concerns and priorities will influence your MEC's strategy as they make their case. Ultimately the abritrator will decide but that decision will be informed by the case your union makes.

Communicate to your reps.

rickair7777

I think either of those would be fine. Longevity and relative seniority are very similar on both lists (unlike VX).

The wildcard variable is WB's... how much bonus seniority do HA pilots get, and what will they do with it when they get it?

The nature of the game is make the strongest case you can, knowing the other side will do the same, and let the judge cut the baby roughly in half.

Personally I would favor baseball style. Some arbitrators are actually prone to implement an informal baseball style, in that if you don't present something vaguely reasonable, he might punish you. But that's personality dependent.

FriendlyPilot

ALPA arbitrators aren't going to care because that its not a consideration for the SLI.