Alaska buying Hawaiian airlines.
12-15-2023, 08:28 AM
#291
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2011
Position: Upright & Breathing
Posts: 319
In that vein, is there any concrete language in the AS CBA that addresses the holding company operating two sister airlines with different seniority lists? All the discussion here has been on a fully integrated airline, but is there anything that would stop them from running two separate airlines under the same holding company like Air France and KLM or Trans States and GoJet?
12-15-2023, 11:11 AM
#292
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2015
Posts: 106
In that vein, is there any concrete language in the AS CBA that addresses the holding company operating two sister airlines with different seniority lists? All the discussion here has been on a fully integrated airline, but is there anything that would stop them from running two separate airlines under the same holding company like Air France and KLM or Trans States and GoJet?
12-15-2023, 06:32 PM
#294
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Joined APC: Jan 2022
Posts: 155
Last edited by Disappointment; 12-15-2023 at 06:50 PM.
12-16-2023, 07:34 PM
#295
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Joined APC: Nov 2021
Posts: 248
12-17-2023, 05:19 PM
#297
New Hire
Joined APC: Dec 2023
Posts: 5
Great Points it's funny how HA management had to go shopping to support their OEM push. I will never taxi the 330 even if the Captain offers me the opportunity, it's not worth the risk.
What everyone fails to recognize is that Asian and European carriers spend up to 9 months in initial training for OEM. Most US initial programs are roughly about 3 weeks, so it's not the OEM that makes them safer (this is management's claim) it's training that creates the safety numbers. Give any US carrier 9 months of initial training and we would never have any incidents, it's apples and oranges...
Unity.....
What everyone fails to recognize is that Asian and European carriers spend up to 9 months in initial training for OEM. Most US initial programs are roughly about 3 weeks, so it's not the OEM that makes them safer (this is management's claim) it's training that creates the safety numbers. Give any US carrier 9 months of initial training and we would never have any incidents, it's apples and oranges...
Unity.....
OEM is being adopted industry wide because if crews aren't flying an aircraft as intended ( i.e. make up their own procedures), then companies will be at fault in the event of an incident.
Also, many FOs around the world taxi. It isn't some kind of superhero strength
12-17-2023, 06:42 PM
#298
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Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: This side of the dirt.
Posts: 897
This is false. I'm at an Asian carrier and it does not take that long, nor does it have anything to do with OEM.
OEM is being adopted industry wide because if crews aren't flying an aircraft as intended ( i.e. make up their own procedures), then companies will be at fault in the event of an incident.
Also, many FOs around the world taxi. It isn't some kind of superhero strength
OEM is being adopted industry wide because if crews aren't flying an aircraft as intended ( i.e. make up their own procedures), then companies will be at fault in the event of an incident.
Also, many FOs around the world taxi. It isn't some kind of superhero strength
12-17-2023, 07:39 PM
#299
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 40,044
12-17-2023, 08:32 PM
#300
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Joined APC: Dec 2023
Posts: 361
This is false. I'm at an Asian carrier and it does not take that long, nor does it have anything to do with OEM.
OEM is being adopted industry wide because if crews aren't flying an aircraft as intended ( i.e. make up their own procedures), then companies will be at fault in the event of an incident.
Also, many FOs around the world taxi. It isn't some kind of superhero strength
OEM is being adopted industry wide because if crews aren't flying an aircraft as intended ( i.e. make up their own procedures), then companies will be at fault in the event of an incident.
Also, many FOs around the world taxi. It isn't some kind of superhero strength
I guess the guidance in the AC from the FAA is incorrect that companies should adopt their own SOP. The industry is not moving in that direction except in your part of the world. In the end, it doesn't matter AS doesn't operate this way and my guess is they will never allow it.
Could you please elaborate on your current Asian carrier's Initial footprint? I would like to know the hours in-ground base trainers, hours in sim, hours in theater for IOE, total legs and hours for IOE, and finally total time from start to finish in days. Unless you are at a very low-budget carrier my guess it's at least triple the time and length of a US carrier.
Always in Unity....
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