The Alaska discount is alive and well
03-14-2023, 06:14 PM
#371
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2006
Position: 737 FO
Posts: 2,370
To each their own. Personally I'd hate to do 4 and 5 day trips being in base. But I totally understand how that's an attractive thing for commuters. Everyone's situation is different.
But what you are talking about, working just 12-13 days a month and 17-18 days off, those are not the Delta guys pulling in gravy. I've come across so many at AS who bring up Delta pilots and what they make, and white slips, green slips, whatever slips, and yet, they compare that to our average guy. News flash, if a narrowbody CA at Delta pulled 500k, he definitely was working the system. He didn't just back and let it rain free money. He had to do something about it to make it happen. But when guys at AS write about literally the same thing, they are ridiculed for living in base and being the exceptions who like to work "a lot."
But what you are talking about, working just 12-13 days a month and 17-18 days off, those are not the Delta guys pulling in gravy. I've come across so many at AS who bring up Delta pilots and what they make, and white slips, green slips, whatever slips, and yet, they compare that to our average guy. News flash, if a narrowbody CA at Delta pulled 500k, he definitely was working the system. He didn't just back and let it rain free money. He had to do something about it to make it happen. But when guys at AS write about literally the same thing, they are ridiculed for living in base and being the exceptions who like to work "a lot."
In a short staffed category, the lucrative thing to do is bid reserve. Pick up premium on days off, then you get the same number of days removed from your next reserve stretch. You can spend a month on reserve and never sit a day of reserve and credit a lot more than any lineholder can. Premium for reserve (green slips) pays at regular pay on top of reserve guarantee but the days off come back to you just at your next reserve days. That only works in a category that is short staffed though. So 737 it works, A220 not so much.. We also have some pilots who credit surf, look for trips in open time that are broken up and have a lot of soft credit and swap. That's more about working less than paying more though.
You're right though, people need to compare actual calenders when comparing pay. I don't think it's as bad as you imply though.
Personally, there is no excuse for Alaska pilots not to make at least as much as any other 737 pilot. With the southeast stuff I think Alaska should pay those pilots more than anyone else in the industry.
. And I can't speak to senior schedules, but I used to have a crash pad in Seattle and as a junior pilot I felt bad when the Alaska pilots asked about schedules.
I really think a thing that really helps is that our reserve gives a similar quality of life to a line even if a commuter. That's massive and impacts everyone. Sometimes the number 1 or 2 pilot will bid reserve and its not uncommon for the plug to be able to hold a line if they want or even be forced to it because there are no more reserve lines available. At the regionals senior pilots used to say reserve rules don't matter because you won't be on it long, but when reserve is good, it really does help everyone.
03-14-2023, 06:18 PM
#372
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2006
Position: 737 FO
Posts: 2,370
For comparison, April CA awards just came out. Bottom lineholder for 737 CA in sea has 19 days off, 7 from the bottom. Next junior lineholder has 17 days off, 11 from the bottom. Lines above them are 19,18,17 days off from bottom up. Lines are 17-19 off for April unless a high credit bid, and I see those at 15 and 16 when bid. Senior reserve is number 24. Reserve days off with no preposted vacation or training is 13 (varies month to month by a few metrics that are posted in PBS prior to bidding).
Last edited by Baradium; 03-14-2023 at 06:30 PM.
03-14-2023, 06:26 PM
#373
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2017
Posts: 257
In Seattle there are a good number of trips that start late or end early so not so bad. I like minimizing my time driving to work so I like to just knock it out. I'll sometimes do a greenslip if it sounds nice, if I'm on reserve it's a no brainer since you get the days off back.
In a short staffed category, the lucrative thing to do is bid reserve. Pick up premium on days off, then you get the same number of days removed from your next reserve stretch. You can spend a month on reserve and never sit a day of reserve and credit a lot more than any lineholder can. Premium for reserve (green slips) pays at regular pay on top of reserve guarantee but the days off come back to you just at your next reserve days. That only works in a category that is short staffed though. So 737 it works, A220 not so much.. We also have some pilots who credit surf, look for trips in open time that are broken up and have a lot of soft credit and swap. That's more about working less than paying more though.
You're right though, people need to compare actual calenders when comparing pay. I don't think it's as bad as you imply though.
Personally, there is no excuse for Alaska pilots not to make at least as much as any other 737 pilot. With the southeast stuff I think Alaska should pay those pilots more than anyone else in the industry.
. And I can't speak to senior schedules, but I used to have a crash pad in Seattle and as a junior pilot I felt bad when the Alaska pilots asked about schedules.
I really think a thing that really helps is that our reserve gives a similar quality of life to a line even if a commuter. That's massive and impacts everyone. Sometimes the number 1 or 2 pilot will bid reserve and its not uncommon for the plug to be able to hold a line if they want or even be forced to it because there are no more reserve lines available. At the regionals senior pilots used to say reserve rules don't matter because you won't be on it long, but when reserve is good, it really does help everyone.
In a short staffed category, the lucrative thing to do is bid reserve. Pick up premium on days off, then you get the same number of days removed from your next reserve stretch. You can spend a month on reserve and never sit a day of reserve and credit a lot more than any lineholder can. Premium for reserve (green slips) pays at regular pay on top of reserve guarantee but the days off come back to you just at your next reserve days. That only works in a category that is short staffed though. So 737 it works, A220 not so much.. We also have some pilots who credit surf, look for trips in open time that are broken up and have a lot of soft credit and swap. That's more about working less than paying more though.
You're right though, people need to compare actual calenders when comparing pay. I don't think it's as bad as you imply though.
Personally, there is no excuse for Alaska pilots not to make at least as much as any other 737 pilot. With the southeast stuff I think Alaska should pay those pilots more than anyone else in the industry.
. And I can't speak to senior schedules, but I used to have a crash pad in Seattle and as a junior pilot I felt bad when the Alaska pilots asked about schedules.
I really think a thing that really helps is that our reserve gives a similar quality of life to a line even if a commuter. That's massive and impacts everyone. Sometimes the number 1 or 2 pilot will bid reserve and its not uncommon for the plug to be able to hold a line if they want or even be forced to it because there are no more reserve lines available. At the regionals senior pilots used to say reserve rules don't matter because you won't be on it long, but when reserve is good, it really does help everyone.
03-14-2023, 06:31 PM
#374
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2022
Posts: 290
I’m not bragging, was just proving a point. Some months I might only have 15 days off, others maybe 19+. I just mix trips to maximize the days off I need/want. Sometimes that means working a bit more, but that usually also means I’m crediting in the 90-100 range too, so it’s all relative…
03-14-2023, 06:41 PM
#375
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2006
Position: 737 FO
Posts: 2,370
I’m not bragging, was just proving a point. Some months I might only have 15 days off, others maybe 19+. I just mix trips to maximize the days off I need/want. Sometimes that means working a bit more, but that usually also means I’m crediting in the 90-100 range too, so it’s all relative…
03-14-2023, 08:27 PM
#376
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2022
Posts: 192
actually the junior lineholders in SEA on the 73 at DL average significantly more days off then us. 16-18 is what I’ve mostly seen. Their schedules and QOL over there along with seniority progression is what sets the two apart. That and the ability to work on different equipment.
03-14-2023, 08:51 PM
#377
What's a weekend?
Joined APC: Dec 2017
Position: Widget FO
Posts: 487
I’m sorry I upset you. Regardless how you feel what I stated is still true. There still is a disparity between the competitors in those areas. Hence the attrition to DAL and not the other way around.
03-15-2023, 06:28 AM
#378
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2017
Posts: 469
Thank you for the information and your professional demeanor. I appreciate it.
03-15-2023, 06:38 AM
#379
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2022
Posts: 290
Gotcha. No, actually people think those days off are unicorns at Alaska.
03-15-2023, 07:18 AM
#380
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2022
Posts: 192
There’s no reason to become triggered over a comment, pal. It’s just an internet forum. As previously stated, the ALA MEC needs to demand the Boomjet and widebody flying if they want to keep anyone with less than 15 years of seniority around.
