Arbitration
10-30-2017, 08:55 PM
#171
Guest
Posts: n/a
It’s worth remembering that we still had 2 years to go on our old pay rates etc. The only reason we got anything is because the company agreed to open the three sections to facilitate the merger with VX. It is what it is and now we move forward with section 6 by 2020. In the mean time the pay will increase 3% a year.
10-30-2017, 09:54 PM
#172
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 614
After reading the full award, I come to the following conclusions:
1) Arbitrators do not consider AS equivalent to the big 3 + Southwest, mostly due to size and "global network" scheme. If anything, AS is a lot closer to Hawaiian than anything else. So any attempt to bring up Alaska to the level of the big boys in regards to full pay scale, 401K contribution, etc will be denied. They'll grant just enough to rank it as number 4-5ish, not top 3.
2) Management did a helluva job selling their pitch about how scope would hinder growth plans and blah blah blah...and arbitrators bought it, as they argue that even though there is no current scope protection, management has at least respected the 76 seat limit so far, when they were not obligated to do it. Arbitrators give management a pat on the back and say to pilots "y'all don't need basic scope on paper as requested by your union, because management has already been respecting it so far without having to...". :rolls eyes:
Not looking purty...
1) Arbitrators do not consider AS equivalent to the big 3 + Southwest, mostly due to size and "global network" scheme. If anything, AS is a lot closer to Hawaiian than anything else. So any attempt to bring up Alaska to the level of the big boys in regards to full pay scale, 401K contribution, etc will be denied. They'll grant just enough to rank it as number 4-5ish, not top 3.
2) Management did a helluva job selling their pitch about how scope would hinder growth plans and blah blah blah...and arbitrators bought it, as they argue that even though there is no current scope protection, management has at least respected the 76 seat limit so far, when they were not obligated to do it. Arbitrators give management a pat on the back and say to pilots "y'all don't need basic scope on paper as requested by your union, because management has already been respecting it so far without having to...". :rolls eyes:
Not looking purty...
10-30-2017, 10:29 PM
#173
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2009
Posts: 396
Management was 100% right. If you want to make big money and have better job security, go fly for the big boys. Best advice ever. Horizon II on the horizon. All is lost when you have weak dip$hit pilots going around saying how we all got early pay raises since the amendable date is ‘18. It’s truly pathetic when one has to justify one’s failure.
10-31-2017, 05:30 AM
#175
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2014
Position: Captain B-737
Posts: 290
The reality is Alaska is now officially a 2nd tier airline...a stepping stone. I'm not at all surprised by the Arbitration results. Also, I don't blame ALPA one bit. The cards are always stacked against us, the "level playing field" one would expect in arbitration is an illusion. Alaska is, (so far) a stable place to work, just know that if you decide to dedicate your working years here, you're going to leave a ton of money on the table. A career at Alaska is going to be worth at least 7 figures less than a legacy airline. Don't expect that to change. I also expect to see a huge uptick in guys leaving which I don't think management cares anything about.
10-31-2017, 05:56 AM
#176
Banned
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,919
Arbitration went exactly like I expected. The only reason I made the comment about pay being fair is because it’s the ONLY thing we didn’t completely lose out on. It’s still not what we deserve. Scope is the big one and we didn’t get one drop of it, so what comes next is going to be really terrifying.
10-31-2017, 06:23 AM
#177
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: SFO Guppy CA
Posts: 1,112
Arbitration went exactly like I expected. The only reason I made the comment about pay being fair is because it’s the ONLY thing we didn’t completely lose out on. It’s still not what we deserve. Scope is the big one and we didn’t get one drop of it, so what comes next is going to be really terrifying.
10-31-2017, 06:31 AM
#178
Banned
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,919
I feel bad for you all!!! I was hoping that the Arbitrator would rule on Scope because the Company "allowed" it to be negotiated. But SNAFU, the Arbitrators still won't rule on something that they deem a business decision. You all are going to have to be ready to walk for Scope on the next go around in 2020. I see QX 175s carrying 88 seats soon. SkyWest can't unless they want to lose their contract with United. Our Scope section doesn't allow for any regional partner to possess any jets with more than 76 seats. Regardless of who they fly them for.
10-31-2017, 06:41 AM
#179
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: SFO Guppy CA
Posts: 1,112
That would be a HUGE loss of flying for them. We are their biggest customer. I can't believe that they would sacrifice all of United's flying for the little flying that they do for you all. That would put them out of business. Our Union would force the termination of their agreement with United.
10-31-2017, 06:47 AM
#180
Banned
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,919
That would be a HUGE loss of flying for them. We are their biggest customer. I can't believe that they would sacrifice all of United's flying for the little flying that they do for you all. That would put them out of business. Our Union would force the termination of their agreement with United.
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